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A Matter of Doubt.

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Jarhyn

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So, I grew up in a conservative home. I was taught to first love and revere truth.

At my youngest age that I remember such things, I asked God, the power of purity, for the wisdom of Solomon.

At a young age, and one of the earlier (but still later than before) things in memory, is that I made a pact. It was open ended: my soul for all the power and wisdom of God, such that I become it entire.

I don't know if anything became of that, because I will not attribute "causality" to "causal adjacency". But I do acknowledge "The Tinkerbell Effect".

I was given a number of tomes I was told contained truth, and nothing but, and truth entire. Which tomes those were is unimportant.

I read them, studied them, studied them, studied them some more, and then was grossly betrayed by someone who purveyed those tomes, according to the principles I learned from the tomes, as the tomes described them.

This cast doubt upon the tomes first recieved and this was my core lesson in learning the power of doubt.

I doubted very hard, and learned the academic purpose of doubt. How to and why to be academic about things, and to why and first how to describe them precisely. This is first where I started to learn the low magic.

But even so, I felt some other higher magic dying inside me for some time. I did not understand that, and so abandoned my academic pursuits for a time. It did not help that I had a deleterious romantic involvement, but whatevs.

I joined the army, after this walkabout. It is perhaps the culmination of it! I got some new tomes to study, and my magic veritably assaulted with the low parts of the Darwinian world.

I actually studied the tomes though. And I learned something useful:

Trust but Verify.


The shape of doubt changed for me in that moment.

While I was in the army, I joined the wiccan chapter, which was more just a general group for occultists and spiritualists. For what is worth I learned much about the surface shapes of what they believed and they had a resemblance in the structure of their understanding tightly resembling that of the first people with the first tomes.


Among them is the first time I claimed the title "Wizard" though not in truth.

It did not bear up under academic scrutiny in that format. I trusted for a while, but failed to verify

i also learned who I am, and that who I am, while a lover of peace and love, am capable of direct action. I have since pushed "the leverage game" twice, escalating to the maximum violence I had available to me in the time.

Shortly after that, my interests in my consensual sexual partners was revealed to be divergent and I was then no longer in the army.

i returned to the academic setting, and learned further the skills of logic and doubt, now armed with trust and a history. I joined (perhaps rejoined; memory gets fuzzy along the military boundary) a forum for skeptics and atheists. There I spent 10 years or so turning my academic mind full of it's razors of doubt, holding first all the ideas of Gods, Demons, Faeries, and so on with trust and trying to actually see, with an academic precision, what it was I was holding in the first place, not with intent to crush it but to merely observe with a fully unclouded third eye.

I discovered what gods may and may not be, what definitions and also what capabilities depending on definition, and I also learned in a backhanded way that I am a god. Not god of this universe, as far as I can tell (unless you consider the God of this universe to be all entities who know the true name thereof, by a very specific and not-very-useful definition of the word).

Since then, have learned that to discuss metaphysics with academic precision, metaphysics which define such powerful ideas as "'mutually compatible self-actualization' is the most powerful basis of strategy in nonspecifically goaled game theory" which is itself, when taken in the context of the use of math, the mathematical name of a particular definition of "God with a capital G" for whatever knowing it is worth to you, one must use language that is precise and take care not to conflate.

Most importantly, I use all this in my pursuit to summon the creation of pure imagination into reality.

At any rate, I am a Wizard: a person who applies the academic model and all according precision to all of metaphysics for the sake of better wielding the power to summon the pure creation of imagination into reality, and for which the foundation of that academic model is doubt.

I'm here now, because as a good friend said just the other day, "go as far as you wish on your own, but do remember to stop back and compare notes from time to time."
 

Mider2009

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It’s important for everyone to go on their own personal quest for truth.

it’s good to have doubt, if you don’t you’ll believe anyone and can be susceptible to being taken advantage of.

when I was a kid Catholicism was the truth, then as a teen I threw myself into scriptures, in my twenties I left the church, I felt betrayed by it and it’s people. I tried being an atheist for a time and couldn’t and started learning the occult.

after several more years I scratched the surface of “the truth” for me. I say for me because I believe in God as the source of all...we all have a spark of the divine in us, everything does. But my truth may not be what you believe yet God is leading you back to him over several lifetimes.

religion can either free or trap you
 

Jarhyn

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It’s important for everyone to go on their own personal quest for truth.

it’s good to have doubt, if you don’t you’ll believe anyone and can be susceptible to being taken advantage of.

when I was a kid Catholicism was the truth, then as a teen I threw myself into scriptures, in my twenties I left the church, I felt betrayed by it and it’s people. I tried being an atheist for a time and couldn’t and started learning the occult.

after several more years I scratched the surface of “the truth” for me. I say for me because I believe in God as the source of all...we all have a spark of the divine in us, everything does. But my truth may not be what you believe yet God is leading you back to him over several lifetimes.

religion can either free or trap you
"Religion" to me, in my structure of understanding, is "uncritical belief". I do not know what you mean when you utter it; apparently the contentious nature of it's definition is the second thing most academics learn about it "religion". But because I expect all ideas in my head to be as coherent as possible, my own definition must so be.

I am not an atheist, specifically because of my critical doubt. Though to be fair neither are most atheists.

"There are zero or more gods" of various definitions of "god" (and one must be careful not to conflate the definitions when talking about if, or how, they "exist", or what bearing the idea of them has on us)! This is not "there are zero gods". I know exactly how and by what mechanics some thing could be "god" by various definitions and concepts. Not every concept to be sure, but many of the coherent ones.

It's just that none of these things has a geometry worthy of "worship" either, except the trivial ones that are static ideas that are so because they are useful (like the one which I used above: it yields power to those who know it not because it is an utterance, but because it is actually knowledge which gives them leverage over ignorance). It is like knowing the name of "NAND", and there is a walking machine of structure and understanding behind it that you have to actually instantiate the soul of it into reality to get anything out of it at all.

"God is the source of all" doesn't speak anything to me without a well modeled idea of God also presented. If you would like to discuss such as a definition of God and bringing it to coherence, ping me in a thread about it, new or old.
 

Mider2009

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"Religion" to me, in my structure of understanding, is "uncritical belief". I do not know what you mean when you utter it; apparently the contentious nature of it's definition is the second thing most academics learn about it "religion". But because I expect all ideas in my head to be as coherent as possible, my own definition must so be.

I am not an atheist, specifically because of my critical doubt. Though to be fair neither are most atheists.

"There are zero or more gods" of various definitions of "god" (and one must be careful not to conflate the definitions when talking about if, or how, they "exist", or what bearing the idea of them has on us)! This is not "there are zero gods". I know exactly how and by what mechanics some thing could be "god" by various definitions and concepts. Not every concept to be sure, but many of the coherent ones.

It's just that none of these things has a geometry worthy of "worship" either, except the trivial ones that are static ideas that are so because they are useful (like the one which I used above: it yields power to those who know it not because it is an utterance, but because it is actually knowledge which gives them leverage over ignorance). It is like knowing the name of "NAND", and there is a walking machine of structure and understanding behind it that you have to actually instantiate the soul of it into reality to get anything out of it at all.

"God is the source of all" doesn't speak anything to me without a well modeled idea of God also presented. If you would like to discuss such as a definition of God and bringing it to coherence, ping me in a thread about it, new or old.
Well I guess we will have to agree to disagree

as I said your truth is yours and mine is mine, the best way to know is experience
 

Jarhyn

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Well I guess we will have to agree to disagree

as I said your truth is yours and mine is mine, the best way to know is experience
Well, we can disagree, and we can agree that we disagree, but because I tend to be a prickly and also because it's been proven that no two systems can hold the same knowledge and reach different conclusions and both be valid conclusions, I can't ever agree to disagreeing. I can agree, at best, to one or more of us being wrong. At least pertains to the ideas of god and religion, insofar as I have defined it.
 

Mider2009

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Well, we can disagree, and we can agree that we disagree, but because I tend to be a prickly and also because it's been proven that no two systems can hold the same knowledge and reach different conclusions and both be valid conclusions, I can't ever agree to disagreeing. I can agree, at best, to one or more of us being wrong. At least pertains to the ideas of god and religion, insofar as I have defined it.
Yet multiple magic systems work.
 

Jarhyn

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Yet multiple magic systems work.
If they do, and you will have to evidence claims to me and be specific about what you are claiming, then this is evidence that those systems are discussing either different machinations of reality, or they are the same machination merely discussed with different language.
 

Mider2009

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If they do, and you will have to evidence claims to me and be specific about what you are claiming, then this is evidence that those systems are discussing either different machinations of reality, or they are the same machination merely discussed with different language.
You can’t prove magic works no more then I can so what’s the point of discussing proof. We choose to believe our works, readings, etc are true but it can be coincidence

there are those who say they can travel the upper worlds yet they’ll just be called looney.

there are indeed different gods and humans are considered to have sparks of the divine yet we are part of the greater Whole...part of God

when people see visions of Jesus, maybe they’re seeing God in a way their beliefs and minds can handle...Moses asked to see God yet God said you can’t, why? Because God in his entirety is beyond us, so Moses saw a glimpse as do we though Moses saw more.

sadly I can’t “prove“ anything to you. I’m not one of the great miracle workers I’ve read about
 

SkullTraill

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Introduction section isn't the place for magickal, occult or philosophical discussion.
 
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