The Qlippoth.

[Wildchildx11]

What is your perspective on the Qlippoth? I'm aware that the Qlippoth that as we understand it is a relatively newer concept, they were just impure shells in Lurinaric Kabbalah dating back to the 15th centuries. I think the first mention of the Qlipoth as a seperate tree is from Kenneth Grant from nightsides of Eden, dating back to 1974, but I have found mentions from books from Dion Fortune of the Klipoth dating back to the 30's.

I work with both the Qlippoth and Hermetic Qabalah and I just view the Qlippoth as unbalanced energies of the regular tree. I do enjoy entity work, but I'm a little disappointed that there aren't a whole lot of correspondences to meditate on and the system feels like it isn't entirely fleshed out.

 

[Wintruz]

What is your perspective on the Qlippoth?

In my opinion, worthless.

It is the half-formulated (or not "fleshed out" as you put it) inversion of someone else's mythology which has arisen because, for reasons best known to them, Western magicians will not untether themselves from Cabala. I really see no distinction between the popular interest in Qlippoth and my picking a foreign culture at random, discovering its gods and then inventing names and correspondences for the opposites of those gods and aligning with those opposites. The obvious question would be: Why?

Anyone would be better off discovering and working with their ancestral gods instead. All pagan gods have the hedonic or war-like qualities which are perceived in Qlippoth but they exist within a far healthier framework and you already have an organic connection to them. From a purely psychological point of view, because pagan gods have been the object of worship, they also have more independent energy than a concept that's been entirely made up and had life breathed into it.

 

[Wildchildx11]

In my opinion, worthless.

It is the half-formulated (or not "fleshed out" as you put it) inversion of someone else's mythology which has arisen because, for reasons best known to them, Western magicians will not untether themselves from Cabala. I really see no distinction between the popular interest in Qlippoth and my picking a foreign culture at random, discovering its gods and then inventing names and correspondences for the opposites of those gods and aligning with those opposites. The obvious question would be: Why?

Anyone would be better off discovering and working with their ancestral gods instead. All pagan gods have the hedonic or war-like qualities which are perceived in Qlippoth but they exist within a far healthier framework and you already have an organic connection to them. From a purely psychological point of view, because pagan gods have been the object of worship, they also have more independent energy than a concept that's been entirely made up and had life breathed into it.

I do realize that it's half-fleshed out, which is why I just attribute it to the regular tree. I think the names of the Qlipha did stem from Crowley, such as Gamaliel, however the system, as presented by Aseneth Mason doesn't feel like a concrete system for spiritual development but it seems to primarily utilize entity work to make up for it.

I mean, the concept is intriguing which is why I read and work with it, but I don't feel like it's an opposite tree.

I don't agree with the ancestral Gods thing, as long as you aren't being offensive, you should be able to work with any Gods you feel drawn to, instead of being limited to a God based on your race or heritage.

 

[Vandheer]

Though Thomas Karlsson had some interesting things to say about Qlippoth, I couldn't care less about either side of that rat maze of a tree.

 

[Amur]

The Qlippoth are said to be the 'shells' of the Sefiras. When I delved into unholyness and demons I noticed that also these are 'empty'. The same formula as in the Qlippoth. Devoid of Love, devoid of Life, and just inside the unholy regime.

 

[Wildchildx11]

The Qlippoth are said to be the 'shells' of the Sefiras. When I delved into unholyness and demons I noticed that also these are 'empty'. The same formula as in the Qlippoth. Devoid of Love, devoid of Life, and just inside the unholy regime.

Except for Da'ath which means knowledge which is fallen.

My perspective is that we incarnate and fall to bring back the knowledge of the divine, which is why I learn about it.

One of my biggest flaws is that if someone warns me against doing something such as "Don't summon the devil!" What are you more likely to want to do?

 

[Wintruz]

I think the names of the Qlipha did stem from Crowley

If I am remembering rightly, he mentions them in passing in Liber Arcanorum.

666 was fluent in the language of Cabala and could make it say what he wanted and so confuddle the magicians of the G.'.D.'.. My view is that, much like his Egyptology, Crowley inherited these languages and expressed some of his concepts in them but that, unless we think there's something unique/special about Victorian Egyptian and Cabala, we're better off removing the trappings and getting to the Heart of his ideas. In my view, much of Thelema is more resonate with the goals of the Left Hand Path than what I see coming from Qlippothic writers, despite the aesthetic differences.

I don't agree with the ancestral Gods thing, as long as you aren't being offensive, you should be able to work with any Gods you feel drawn to, instead of being limited to a God based on your race or heritage.

There are a lot of hidden upsides to working with the gods that your ancestors worshipped. However, I wouldn't say "Thou must". If there's other gods that speak to your soul, Work with them.

 

[Wildchildx11]

If I am remembering rightly, he mentions them in passing in Liber Arcanorum.

666 was fluent in the language of Cabala and could make it say what he wanted and so confuddle the magicians of the G.'.D.'.. My view is that, much like his Egyptology, Crowley inherited these languages and expressed some of his concepts in them but that, unless we think there's something unique/special about Victorian Egyptian and Cabala, we're better off removing the trappings and getting to the Heart of his ideas. In my view, much of Thelema is more resonate with the goals of the Left Hand Path than what I see coming from Qlippothic writers, despite the aesthetic differences.

There are a lot of hidden upsides to working with the gods that your ancestors worshipped. However, I wouldn't say "Thou must". If there's other gods that speak to your soul, Work with them.

I come from a different perspective than you, because I don't think there is anything wrong with having your beliefs and I do respect them, because they come from a place where you have actually given consideration to them, but the whole "ethnocentrism" and ancestral God's stuff is usually associated with National Socialism beliefs.


I do believe in your right to have them, they just are not my beliefs. I like being around people of different cultural cultural and ethnic backgrounds.

 

[Parallax]

Are you the strongest because you are satoru gojo or are you satoru gojo because you are the strongest?
Which is to say does something exist because we formulate a system to work with it or does the system exist because there is already something to work with?
In my opinion whether or not a system surrounding a concept is fully uniquely fleshed out doesn’t mean that the hidden metaphysical nature of that thing isn’t worth looking into or doesn’t exist. It’s a matter of time and cultural development around the concept to receive a more unique system.
All symbols and thus systems are merely devices to help understand and access otherwise consciously unknowable realities.
The more one interacts with this unknowable force, the more unique elements and symbols will spill forth and be organized into systems.

 

[Robert Ramsay]

The Qlippoth are said to be the 'shells' of the Sefiras. When I delved into unholyness and demons I noticed that also these are 'empty'. The same formula as in the Qlippoth. Devoid of Love, devoid of Life, and just inside the unholy regime.

This too, is my understanding of Qlippoth. Maybe any Qlippoth which has 'energy' is not the true Qlippoth

 

[Voidking]

I view the Qlippoth simply as a map to navigate through the darkest aspects of your subconscious mind and hence manifest in your world through imagination and astral senses.

Dark Gods/Goddesses and anti-cosmic entities, thursars or whatever system you're inspired by, represent instinctive-ophidian-atavistic-chaotic energies, by invoquing these entities you are inviting them into your consciousness. I find these very empowering for people who want to embark on the solitary path of self-cultivation.

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

I've traveled everyday king qlippothic entities in my past. It brought change s and death into my household.
I strongly advise leaving it alone. As my teacher warned me several times.
If you do intend to dabble with my t, look at VK's site:

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I've tried evoking qlippothic entities in the past. It brought chaos and death energies into my life.

 

[Wildchildx11]

I've traveled everyday king qlippothic entities in my past. It brought change s and death into my household.
I strongly advise leaving it alone. As my teacher warned me several times.
If you do intend to dabble with my t, look at VK's site:

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Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

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I've tried evoking qlippothic entities in the past. It brought chaos and death energies into my life.

I've already had chaos and death energies in my life before I've been working with Qlippoth.

It's made me strong.

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

Okay then. So what is it you want to know about the Qlippoth? Have you tried invoking the entities in order through VK Jehannums rituals? What dream diary do you keep on a daily basis?
My perspective was to leave it alone. Their house, their rules.
777 has more than enough correspondences.

 

[Wildchildx11]

I've been using Tree of Qlippoh by Aseneth Mason.

I just started using the journal on this site.

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Speaking of which, maybe I already understand death and qlippothic energetic pretty well.

 

[Xenophon]

In my opinion, worthless.

It is the half-formulated (or not "fleshed out" as you put it) inversion of someone else's mythology which has arisen because, for reasons best known to them, Western magicians will not untether themselves from Cabala. I really see no distinction between the popular interest in Qlippoth and my picking a foreign culture at random, discovering its gods and then inventing names and correspondences for the opposites of those gods and aligning with those opposites. The obvious question would be: Why?

Anyone would be better off discovering and working with their ancestral gods instead. All pagan gods have the hedonic or war-like qualities which are perceived in Qlippoth but they exist within a far healthier framework and you already have an organic connection to them. From a purely psychological point of view, because pagan gods have been the object of worship, they also have more independent energy than a concept that's been entirely made up and had life breathed into it.

Actually there's a good dose of irony in Qabala-olotry: discontent with the Semitic religion their ancestors had been saddled with, what did 19th century coulda-been spiritual argonauts do? Saddle themselves with Semitic occultism.

 

[Wildchildx11]

Actually there's a good dose of irony in Qabala-olotry: discontent with the Semitic religion their ancestors had been saddled with, what did 19th century coulda-been spiritual argonauts do? Saddle themselves with Semitic occultism.

Treaties on the Left Hand Emantion is actually the foundation for a lot of the Qlippothic theories, I haven't read it in it's original text, so I can't comment, but it dates to the 13th century.

I think, but am not sure that it focused on evil being on the Left Side of the tree and not a seperate tree.

 

[Parallax]

I've been using Tree of Qlippoh by Aseneth Mason.

I just started using the journal on this site.

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Speaking of which, maybe I already understand death and qlippothic energetic pretty well.

Temple of black light current is superior imo
Just tastes better.

 

[Xenophon]

Temple of black light current is superior imo
Just tastes better.

I'll second that---they have a certain volitional momentum in their stuff on the Qlipoth.

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Treaties on the Left Hand Emantion is actually the foundation for a lot of the Qlippothic theories, I haven't read it in it's original text, so I can't comment, but it dates to the 13th century.

I think, but am not sure that it focused on evil being on the Left Side of the tree and not a seperate tree.

The treatise is still a late growth the tradition I mentioned and excoriate.

 

[motzfeldt]

You should read 2 of Thomas Karlssons books - "Qabalah, Qlipoth and Goetic Magic" and "Black Mass: The Sabbatic Tradition of Shaitan and the Sexual Sorcery of the Qliphotic Dark Paths". If the Qlipoth has hitherto been something not entirely developed, well, with his investigation and lifetime dedication to it, it certainly is something much more alive now.