You're Being Programmed to Trust AI

[KjEno186]

You're being programmed (by propaganda) to put your trust in so-called Artificial Intelligence, but why should you?

Having worked with Stable Diffusion, I can say without a doubt that the prompt and model are integral to getting the results I have in mind. The same thing can be said about other AI systems for generating content: human intelligences with pre-conceived concepts control the inputs in order to achieve desired outputs. If the output is not what was expected, the inputs are changed until the desired output is reached.

But this is not how AI is presented in media to the layperson. AI is often presented as though it objectively examined all possible sources of information and that the results are unbiased by human interference. Just remember, AI does not publish its own results to the public. There is always the human element of bias involved before the media-consuming public is exposed to the results, which unsurprisingly will reflect the bias of the publishers.

“Since modern man has no way of knowing what is going on beyond himself, since he cannot know everything, he would become lost in a world as vast and technically complex as ours, if he had really no one to guide him. He no longer relies on priests and philosophers, of course, but he must rely on people nevertheless, more than ever, as a matter of fact.” - Rene Girard, Resurrection from the Underground: Feodor Dostoevsky​

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"Experts are the ones who help mediate desires, who tell us what is worth wanting and what is not. ...​

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"We’re model addicts. Right now, the models we prefer are experts.​

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"That could be because we think of ourselves as more rational than ever—and we are, in many ways. Scientific progress has been swift in the past hundred years. However, we underestimate the strong role that mimesis* plays in the way we choose our experts.​

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"What is our basis for taking a source as authoritative? Is it because we checked all of the person’s credentials? Is it because the source was fact-checked by Peter Canby’s team at the New Yorker? Or is it because the person has the most followers on social media and a “Verified” sticker next to their name? Authority is more mimetic than we like to believe. The fastest way to become an expert is to convince a few of the right people to call you an expert.​

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"The cult of saints has become the cult of experts. That doesn’t mean we no longer rely on models to figure out what to want. It means that in a post-Enlightenment world, the preferred models are often those who seem most enlightened: the experts." - Luke Burgis, Wanting: The Power of Mimetic Desire in Everyday Life​

* Rene Girard used the word mimesis (mi-mee-sis) to mean sophisticated forms of imitation, from the Greek word mimesthai (meaning “to imitate”)

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"Although the differences in participants’ reliance on the two [AI chess] coaches were not large, that is no win for trustworthy AI. Quite the opposite! It shows the ability of untrustworthy AI to deceive many participants. ... Our results show evidence that participants reduced their reliance on the untrustworthy coach by the last game. However, by that time the damage would have already been done ..."​

 

[Pyrokar]

For a week or two i was big on an AI index website ( there's an ai for that)
Started hoarding the many diverse options and sorting out what would be useful,
Then it became apparent to me they are all designed to steal personal information and data, for mediocre service
Likely to sell it off later, but yeah i was out of there quick and clean.
Still it's a shame, Ai might have actually contributed before the suits got their grubby paws on it.

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

Back in the early 90s I was interested in hacking/phreaking, artificial intelligence, as my school offered programs related to the AI and Data Security.
This is when I switched from Anthropology as a major to Computer Science and burnt myself out of school in my junior year.
Nonetheless my view was for medicine and education and military as the only reasons for AI, not to substitute but to enhance the knowledge of the professionals.
Later on in pursuit of an Associate of Arts in LSA, one of my English Composition essays was on Use of Biometrics and the Failures Thereof. It was then and working on a bank data center that I began to dislike AI and Biometrics.
There is always someone's agenda not in our best own interests behind the new technology.

 

[Robert Ramsay]

The main confusion I see is between what we have now and are calling 'AI' and actual AI (i.e. an ACTUAL artifical intelligence)

What we have now is basically a kind of autocorrect that has so much training data, it can (with the wind blowing in the right direction) fool some people some of the time.

To quote an artist I follow on Twitter:
"It's interesting that when people predict the end of humanity via robots they imagine the robots being to blame and not the money obsessed billionaires behind them, racing to replace ineffective humans with AI and machines for maximum profit."

 

[KjEno186]

Artificial Intelligence is presented to the public as both "numbers don't lie," but also as imitating human capabilities, only better. I'd call it a sophisticated algorithmic toolkit designed to mimic human behavior on a surface level. Human mimicry aside, AI is a tool. Like statistics. You know? "

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"?

The issue, as you guys have each pointed out, is that "experts" are using it to bolster their perceived correctness, and this has already proven to be highly problematic with the use of statistics, which is a data examination toolkit we've had since before digital computers were available to anyone. People use statistics to manipulate public opinion, and artificial intelligence is now being used the same way. Let me be perfectly clear, I'm not in any way concerned about a "Skynet" problem with AI. Consider this quote from Wanting by Luke Burgis:

CENTRALLY PLANNED WANTING​

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Political debates about the extent to which we should engineer desire are perennial. We just never frame them that way.​

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This is not the place for an in-depth exploration of desire and politics, but I will suggest one underappreciated way of looking at political questions: What effect does a political system or a policy have on what people want? What are its effects on desire?​

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Authoritarian regimes can only stay in existence so long as they can control what people want. We normally think of these regimes as controlling what people can and cannot do through laws, regulations, policing, and penalties. But their real victory comes not when they have authority over people’s actions; rather, their victory comes when they have authority over their desires. They don’t want to keep prisoners in cells; they want those prisoners to learn to love their cells. When there is no desire for change, their authority is complete.​

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The purpose of a “reeducation” camp is not about relearning how to write or read or interpret history, or even how to think; it’s fundamentally about the reeducation of desire. Russian scholars Catriona Kelly and Vadim Volkov have pointed out in their essay “Directed Desires: Kul’turnost’ and Consumption” that the transition to Soviet Russia came about through what they call directed desires. There was a subtle campaign to direct people to want certain things and reject others. The idea of kulturnost, or culturedness in English, began to emerge. It was a right way to live based on shared Russian cultural values.​

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The leaders of the Gulag labor camps tried to starve prisoners’ desires for things that were not aligned with their ideas of what was desirable. They fed those that were. Author Roy Medvedev recounts one woman’s experience after being released: “I am disappointed in everything and believe in nothing anymore, but I have one desire—to eat ice cream every day, not beauty, not love.” Her desire for anything more than ice cream had been destroyed. But now she needed a refrigerator and economic security to eat ice cream all the time. She ended up supporting the very political party that had enslaved her because it was the only party that promised to help her fulfill the impoverished desire they had given her.​

If someone makes a claim of knowledge based on artificial intelligence, they should be held to the same level of scrutiny as any other so-called expert. Considering the all too human tendency for domination, I'd even go so far as to demand a higher degree of scrutiny from claims based on AI.

Let me add that I'm not against Statistics any more than AI. They are just tools. All I'm saying is, be aware of the ways such tools have historically been misused.

 

[Pyrokar]

Actually, glad for this thread as it reminded me why i was on the lookout for the AI in the first place.
I would start up a whole new thread yet i believe it to be a one and done sort of question, and already have
the big boyz here who know their way.
I was primarily interested in voice-over text to speech to use for reading these pesky ebooks (if you own a kindle
i automatically assume you pretentious and evil ,which is not related to the fact i can't afford one)
"Balabolka" windows app was a sort of alternative i found but the question remains where are all the useful programs bro?
Turned out it was hard for me to find when i tried and every search would lead me to those "10 best programs to use" type crap
any indexes out there that list them according to use/tags/etc ?

 

[8Lou1]

Index:

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[Pyrokar]

Thank you. Unfortunately these are all AI which i have learned to avoid.
Either way, my apologies for derailling the thread.

 

[KjEno186]

Thank you. Unfortunately these are all AI which i have learned to avoid.
Either way, my apologies for derailling the thread.

Start a new thread with your topic. I installed an app which might work for you, or not, but I'd rather not discuss it in this thread.

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

There are all sorts of algorithms, two of which before the use of AI were Genetic Algorithms and Neural Networks (eg modelling the brain mathematically) Programming.
In this day and age, the rich cannot be satisfied. Not until they are on another planet and warring with each other for control of resources. My opinion.

Post automatically merged: Nov 6, 2023

Automation 8s however, heavily tied to use of AI. All to replace the human.
Japan created robotic humanoids, who once was asked "what do you think of humans?". The answer was "Humans? We have no need for humans."
Think about that.
In automation and robotics, like any technology, can be used for good or evil.

 

[Iambutastudent]

I appreciate your well though out perspective. As Robert Ramsay pointed out, the AI we're currently exposed to is distinct from artificial general intelligence (AGI). Expectedly, the nuance here is lost on the average person, so your concern is apt.

That being said, for the cautious and discerning among us, our current iteration of AI offers immense utility and potential, pitfalls notwithstanding. I'm also warily intrigued by the prospect of AGI. I cant deny my desire to experience the genesis of a truly autonomous novel intelligence.

 

[SkullTraill]

I agree completely. The masses are being programmed not just to trust, but to be dependent on centralised, biased, LLMs. It's only a matter of time until they become integrated into most, if not all our daily personal AND work use software tools. Of course, the powers that be will be the ones with the switch and knobs for these systems, so once the masses fully trust and fully depend on them, it'll be just another (way more effective) steering wheel with which to control the direction of collective thinking.

I strongly suggest downloading, archiving, collecting as many completely open source, locally-run LLMs that you can, even if your hardware isn't able to currently run them, in case they become contraband in the future. Because no doubt there will come a point where being anti-AI will be a legitimate disadvantage (like bringing a knife to a gun fight).

As for AGI, I think we're still far enough away from that (until we have legitimately mass producible Quantum Computers) that it is not a concern for me, and people mistaking LLMs for AGI is of no consequence to me, simply adding to the pile of retards I have to step over.

 

[Ziran]

For what it's worth, my daughter is being taught the limitations of AI in college. It's well known in the academic community it cannot do proper literary analysis. Her teacher warned the students, "Don't even try it. I'll catch you if you try to use AI to complete your assignments." And a few did try it, and they were caught. My daughter said it wasn't an AI scanner. It's that the teacher can easily detect the AI's work, writing style, and the mistakes it often makes.

 

[Xenophon]

For what it's worth, my daughter is being taught the limitations of AI in college. It's well known in the academic community it cannot do proper literary analysis. Her teacher warned the students, "Don't even try it. I'll catch you if you try to use AI to complete your assignments." And a few did try it, and they were caught. My daughter said it wasn't an AI scanner. It's that the teacher can easily detect the AI's work, writing style, and the mistakes it often makes.

There's an economic niche to fill: rewriting AI-generated essays so as to make them sound human. Though I imagine there's already work being done on AI to have it rewrite the other AI's work.

 

[Robert Ramsay]

There's an economic niche to fill: rewriting AI-generated essays so as to make them sound human. Though I imagine there's already work being done on AI to have it rewrite the other AI's work.

This is currently where the big bucks are in AI generation. Hiring 'AI wranglers' who can twist the prompts to their will and then rewrite the results.

As always: "Do not call up that which you cannot put down"

 

[Ziran]

There's an economic niche to fill: rewriting AI-generated essays so as to make them sound human.

It's already happening. It's one of the reasons AI makes mistakes and can be manipulated.

Though I imagine there's already work being done on AI to have it rewrite the other AI's work.

Yes, It's aIready happening. It's code writing code which then debugs itself.

 

[Taudefindi]

You're being programmed (by propaganda) to put your trust in so-called Artificial Intelligence

Really?I personally don't like AI because as an artist myself I know how much it is annoying to see people steal an artist's work, use it to teach AI and then use the AI to "make art themselves".

AI could be much more useful in other areas, and yet here we are, seeing people use AI to take away the work of artists.

there will come a point where being anti-AI will be a legitimate disadvantage

I don't know about "disadvantage", but if you say you're against AI in social medias the "AI bros" will come to terrorize you.

And if you're an artist they'll call you all kinds of new made-up slurs in order to make you feel awful for actually being someone that bothered with learning a skill, rather than being someone that depends heavily on a program(basically) to make a collage of things based on the prompts you give.

Oh the jealousy of those that are too lazy or too inept to bother with learning an artistic craft...

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

It's funny that AI was actually a DARPA program in it's conception, which people are unaware of or didn't research far back enough. So why the DoD behind it? What were the original programming languages behind it ... LISP, Prolog, and all the prehistoric programming languages and why? Why was another DoD and DARPA SATNET project measuring the socio-economic and psychological ramifications created? Is it just the billionaires behind it or .. something more sinister? Could the old movie called Wargames be involved somehow?

 

[KjEno186]

Really?

Yes. People like my elderly parents still pay attention to the talking heads on the television, because they grew up trusting people wearing suits being "respectable" and telling stories that sounded like "truth" most of the time. They are told all the hype about AI, because "experts" will turn around and claim "special knowledge" from their algorithmic oracles. Welcome to the new priesthood! Beware bowing down before their idols.

the old movie called Wargames

About as believable as the computer scenes from Weird Science...

As for the "why" of AI development, it should be pretty clear by now that automated social credit systems are gradually being implemented in countries around the world as a means of resource management. And bloated defense budgets encourage profligate spending on high complexity technological means of killing people in increasingly impersonal ways.

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

Loved Wierd Science.