Sartael Comes to Collect

[Eldros]

Imagine this:

You have three wishes from a demon. Let’s call him Sartael.
He guarantees that you get exactly what you ask for, so you can ask for anything. No flaws, no tricks, and no "you could have said it differently" He fulfills his promises.
Sounds excellent, doesn't it?
There is only one catch..
He wants you to do him a small favor in return.
When you ask, he won't tell you what it is. He assures you that it won't instantly endanger your life and that it will be something "modest."
The thing is that, well, you know it's a demon. For one small favor, why would he give you three wishes?/
Would you accept the proposal?
What would you want, and how much would you be prepared to risk, if you did?

 

[Aeternus]

Imagine this:

You have three wishes from a demon. Let’s call him Sartael.
He guarantees that you get exactly what you ask for, so you can ask for anything. No flaws, no tricks, and no "you could have said it differently" He fulfills his promises.
Sounds excellent, doesn't it?
There is only one catch..
He wants you to do him a small favor in return.
When you ask, he won't tell you what it is. He assures you that it won't instantly endanger your life and that it will be something "modest."
The thing is that, well, you know it's a demon. For one small favor, why would he give you three wishes?/
Would you accept the proposal?
What would you want, and how much would you be prepared to risk, if you did?

I for one would never risk any desire to be fulfilled by the Demons, no matter which one is (by means of name), or any sigil whatsoever.

Especially if we talk about Sartael, which although a minor demon, still it is worth noting how his name is also related to Sathariel / The Concelears in the Qliphoth. I would not risk my soul, or anything else related to Faustian bargain style for any wishes, no matter how flawless that wish would be.

And, as a conclusion, dare I ask this question: If the Demon told you to do anything harmful or spread lies, etc, would that thing be worth any of your dignity / relations / general life?

 

[Eldros]

I for one would never risk any desire to be fulfilled by the Demons, no matter which one is (by means of name), or any sigil whatsoever.

Especially if we talk about Sartael, which although a minor demon, still it is worth noting how his name is also related to Sathariel / The Concelears in the Qliphoth. I would not risk my soul, or anything else related to Faustian bargain style for any wishes, no matter how flawless that wish would be.

And, as a conclusion, dare I ask this question: If the Demon told you to do anything harmful or spread lies, etc, would that thing be worth any of your dignity / relations / general life?

Well, dear colleague, I can only thank you for taking the time to answer - and perhaps even more so because you were the only one who did.
With so many topics being thrown around in the tavern, I suppose I should point out that some of the greatest ideas and works were born in taverns, among friends, over a glass of something strong.
Writers and thinkers have always found a little inspiration there.
To answer your question, I would never sell my soul or bend my morals or principles for a wish.
The whole thing was simply a thought experiment - I was curious how people would approach a deal where the wishes are guaranteed, but the price is unknown..
And yes, if the favor involved harming someeone or acting against my values, I'd simply refuse.
No wish would be worth that.

 

[Nembra]

I mean, this would be a very dumb demon since you can easily use one of the wishes to get out of giving him anything. Unfortunately I've never met one that stupid.

 

[12RelayT10]

I think you overlooked one thing: if you don’t take the deal, all your loved ones and all your descendants will suffer forever. So, what do you do?

 

[Eldros]

I mean, this would be a very dumb demon since you can easily use one of the wishes to get out of giving him anything. Unfortunately I've never met one that stupid.

Well, but you're thinking that one of my wishes can end the deal entirely.
I didn't say he lets me change the terms of our agreement; in fact, I said he does exactly what I ask for.
Also, that would be the most absurd aspect of the case if the demon's only defense was "you could wish your way out of it."
The true problem is why is he willing to grant me three unrestricted wishes in exchange for my small favor...

Post automatically merged: Sep 11, 2026

I think you overlooked one thing: if you don’t take the deal, all your loved ones and all your descendants will suffer forever. So, what do you do?

Then I’m probably not taking the deal.
If a demon has to threaten my loved ones just because I said no, that tells me pretty much everything I need to know about his idea of a “modest” favor.

 

[Nembra]

Well, but you're thinking that one of my wishes can end the deal entirely.
I didn't say he lets me change the terms of our agreement; in fact, I said he does exactly what I ask for.
Also, that would be the most absurd aspect of the case if the demon's only defense was "you could wish your way out of it."
The true problem is why is he willing to grant me three unrestricted wishes in exchange for my small favor...

I can wish to know that. In fact I can wish to both read and control his thoughts. That's the problem with wishes, you can always break the system.

 

[Eldros]

I can wish to know that. In fact I can wish to both read and control his thoughts. That's the problem with wishes, you can always break the system.

I get it…If wishes are really infinite, you can just wish to know exactly what the favor is, what Sartael wants, whether he’s lying, etc.
.At that point you have almost broken the dilemma.
My idea is, before I use a wish to get rid of all the uncertainty, I'd be asking myself why a demon is offering me three unlimited wishes in return for one "modest" favor in the first place./
But yeah, you've found the obvious loop hole. You got me on that one..

 

[Nembra]

I get it…If wishes are really infinite, you can just wish to know exactly what the favor is, what Sartael wants, whether he’s lying, etc.
.At that point you have almost broken the dilemma.
My idea is, before I use a wish to get rid of all the uncertainty, I'd be asking myself why a demon is offering me three unlimited wishes in return for one "modest" favor in the first place./
But yeah, you've found the obvious loop hole. You got me on that one..

I mean, if we do want to go down that route, giving someone what he wants will inevitably ruin him one way or another, so it might be just that.

 

[Eldros]

I mean, if we do want to go down that route, giving someone what he wants will inevitably ruin him one way or another, so it might be just that.

Yeah, that's a lot more interesting. Then the wishes themselves are the trap, and the favor is almost irrelevant..
But now I'm curious - do you mean getting everything I want would actually ruin me, or that I'd just end up becoming someone I don't like?/

 

[Nembra]

Yeah, that's a lot more interesting. Then the wishes themselves are the trap, and the favor is almost irrelevant..
But now I'm curious - do you mean getting everything I want would actually ruin me, or that I'd just end up becoming someone I don't like?/

One of the core problems of being a human being is that nobody has a good idea what's good for them, that is: what would make them happy. Normally the world pushes back against our mistaken projects, confronting, revealing and refining our self-perceptions. To grant a wish is to smash someone face-first against their own deficiency at terminal velocity, and there is no one who would survive that impact.

 

[12RelayT10]

Then I’m probably not taking the deal.
If a demon has to threaten my loved ones just because I said no, that tells me pretty much everything I need to know about his idea of a “modest” favor.

You might be right to “pretend” you don’t understand. What I’m pointing at is the fact that you are already too late. It was never about a small favor, you see, that is how magicians work.

 

[Eldros]

One of the core problems of being a human being is that nobody has a good idea what's good for them, that is: what would make them happy. Normally the world pushes back against our mistaken projects, confronting, revealing and refining our self-perceptions. To grant a wish is to smash someone face-first against their own deficiency at terminal velocity, and there is no one who would survive that impact.

So the demon's real trick is just taking us at our word.
He gives us exactly what we ask for and lets us figure out, usually too late,, that we didn't really know what we wanted in the first place.
Which makes me wonder if the really dangerous wish isn't - give me everything I want, but - give me what I actually need.

Post automatically merged: Sep 11, 2026

You might be right to “pretend” you don’t understand. What I’m pointing at is the fact that you are already too late. It was never about a small favor, you see, that is how magicians work.

I see... I'm obviously already involved by the time I understand there was a deception.

OK. Still, I believe I will still reject the offer. It's probably best to avoid playing certain games.

 

[Nembra]

So the demon's real trick is just taking us at our word.
He gives us exactly what we ask for and lets us figure out, usually too late,, that we didn't really know what we wanted in the first place.
Which makes me wonder if the really dangerous wish isn't - give me everything I want, but - give me what I actually need.

The thing is, everyone already was given what they actually need. Of course, people need all kinds of things for comfort, fulfillment, even survival, but the ultimate, existential need cannot be satisfied by anything that comes from the world. The thing standing between a man and his happiness is not in what he has but what choices does he make.

 

[Eldros]

The thing is, everyone already was given what they actually need. Of course, people need all kinds of things for comfort, fulfillment, even survival, but the ultimate, existential need cannot be satisfied by anything that comes from the world. The thing standing between a man and his happiness is not in what he has but what choices does he make.

But “what I actually need” might just be “the decisions I have to make.”
And this is the scary part: since happiness depends on our choices, no wish can help us with the decision without taking away something very important from us...
Maybe that’s why we can’t get what we need - we have to become the kind of person who can choose it.//

 

[Ohana]

Imagine this:

You have three wishes from a demon. Let’s call him Sartael.
He guarantees that you get exactly what you ask for, so you can ask for anything. No flaws, no tricks, and no "you could have said it differently" He fulfills his promises.
Sounds excellent, doesn't it?
There is only one catch..
He wants you to do him a small favor in return.
When you ask, he won't tell you what it is. He assures you that it won't instantly endanger your life and that it will be something "modest."
The thing is that, well, you know it's a demon. For one small favor, why would he give you three wishes?/
Would you accept the proposal?
What would you want, and how much would you be prepared to risk, if you did?

If a daemon SartaeI visits me without doing any summoning or any work or anything and says to me this what I do is start asking questions.
To start off what? Why? Who? How? And what is going on. Why wouId you be here without me doing anything to get your attention?

But if I'm being reaIistic for this scenario I would probably just burst out crying in fear then SartaeI wouId Iikely just Ieave since its awkward to be there when someone's crying. Then I wouId IikeIy be forever scarred for Iife by this exchange and be in therapy for Iife.
I wouId have nightmares of this for Iife and then die aIone in fear and terror since I wouId be so freaked out by this I couId be barely successful in my Iife.

So I guess in the end damned if you do damned if you don't for me for this made up scenario.

 

[Ohana]

Also what more can this figure do? What more?

The "modest" favor I mean. Many peopIe aIready beIieve if they don't do good enough in Iife they are doomed for aII eternity in inferno. And thats a beIief heId by a substantial amount of peopIe.

So what more couId this figure even do? Is there double eternity, triple eternity, enternity plus one hundred other eternities. Eternity that is eternaIIy bigger than another eternity of suffering. One "smaII" favor. This figure has aIready made so much. How can you top an eternity of suffering in one pIace? What more couId it possibly do now I'm curious. I'm reaIIy curious and slightly annoyed. (Not at anyone just made up scenarios and everything eIse)

 

[Eldros]

Also what more can this figure do? What more?

The "modest" favor I mean. Many peopIe aIready beIieve if they don't do good enough in Iife they are doomed for aII eternity in inferno. And thats a beIief heId by a substantial amount of peopIe.

So what more couId this figure even do? Is there double eternity, triple eternity, enternity plus one hundred other eternities. Eternity that is eternaIIy bigger than another eternity of suffering. One "smaII" favor. This figure has aIready made so much. How can you top an eternity of suffering in one pIace? What more couId it possibly do now I'm curious. I'm reaIIy curious and slightly annoyed. (Not at anyone just made up scenarios and everything eIse)

If he’s already got eternal damnation on the table, what’s he gonna do next, invent Ultra Hell?
I think the scary part wouldn’t necessarily be that the favor is worse than Hell. It could just be something completely different. Like maybe he wants a small thing from you that sounds harmless, but has some really weird consequences.
Though, I’d be more curious about why a demon who can give me anything needs a small favor from me in the first place. That’s the part that would make me nervous.

 

[Frater M.M.]

Imagine this:

You have three wishes from a demon. Let’s call him Sartael.
He guarantees that you get exactly what you ask for, so you can ask for anything. No flaws, no tricks, and no "you could have said it differently" He fulfills his promises.
Sounds excellent, doesn't it?
There is only one catch..
He wants you to do him a small favor in return.
When you ask, he won't tell you what it is. He assures you that it won't instantly endanger your life and that it will be something "modest."
The thing is that, well, you know it's a demon. For one small favor, why would he give you three wishes?/
Would you accept the proposal?
What would you want, and how much would you be prepared to risk, if you did?

I'd wish for:

[1] The perfect GF.
[2] £10 million.
[3] Bod of a young Arnie.

What could possibly go wrong?

-------------

tbh I'd probably do it if it were to help a close relative/loved one in some weird situation like having been kidnapped and being slowly tortured or having to live with some very painful but slow degenerative disease. I'd take most consequences for that, especially if it were a young child.

 

[Eldros]

I'd wish for:

[1] The perfect GF.
[2] £10 million.
[3] Bod of a young Arnie.

What could possibly go wrong?

-------------

tbh I'd probably do it if it were to help a close relative/loved one in some weird situation like having been kidnapped and being slowly tortured or having to live with some very painful but slow degenerative disease. I'd take most consequences for that, especially if it were a young child.

The young Arnie one is a brave choice… I’d be a bit worried about what Sartael has planned for you!
I’d probably take the deal if it meant saving someone I really loved from something awful.
For myself, though… I’m not sure I’d trust a demon offering me three wishes that much...