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I have been interested in the Freesmiths for a while now but the only thing besides wikipedia i can find is a website claiming to be them wich just sells some
book wich looks like a scam
Does anyone have any info on their practices/traditions and did anyone buy the book and get sent the "training course to study at home" and can tell me about it
Look up the works / words of Manly P Hall, particularly Initiates of the Flame & The Divine Heart of Healing and Etidorpha for fun Freemason "fiction".
I just had a look at the site. Not impresssed. As you said vague. Plus any fool who has ever seen a Damascus blade, an antique katana, held a modern Fairbairn-Sykes knife can tell you European steel at and before the time of Charlemagne was scarcely "the highest quality the world has ever seen." If the site gets that wrong it makes you wonder what they get right. Plus, the chick they got at the top of the web page at first glance looks about age 12. On second look, it turns out she's got eyes like Chucky picking up a butcher knife. (Doubtless one hand-forged from the "highest quality steel" your liver has ever hosted.)
Of course, the site could be initiatory. A grueling test of whether one can set aside that crippling scepticism that has dogged his days.
I just had a look at the site. Not impresssed. As you said vague. Plus any fool who has ever seen a Damascus blade, an antique katana, held a modern Fairbairn-Sykes knife can tell you European steel at and before the time of Charlemagne was scarcely "the highest quality the world has ever seen." If the site gets that wrong it makes you wonder what they get right. Plus, the chick they got at the top of the web page at first glance looks about age 12. On second look, it turns out she's got eyes like Chucky picking up a butcher knife. (Doubtless one hand-forged from the "highest quality steel" your liver has ever hosted.)
Of course, the site could be initiatory. A grueling test of whether one can set aside that crippling scepticism that has dogged his days.
Found some stuff on reddit if anyone else is interested
First: Apperently some guy actually bought the booklet and was invited for a fee of 1400dollars so the website sems like a dead end also the booklet apperantly has a lot of fabricated history inside (will reach out to the guy to see if i can get a bookscan)
Second: They were mentioned
Found some stuff on reddit if anyone else is interested
First: Apperently some guy actually bought the booklet and was invited for a fee of 1400dollars so the website sems like a dead end also the booklet apperantly has a lot of fabricated history inside (will reach out to the guy to see if i can get a bookscan)
Second: They were mentioned
From what I know of the Freemasons, they also charge an initiatory fee. I don't know of many actual secret societies that don't charge fees. I mean they were originally created for the rich to have orgies </j>
In all seriousness, dues and upfront fees are common for actual initiatory societies. If not to see how serious you are, but at least to make sure you're on the hook for something.
Not directly no, but we both emerged out of Scottish work guild culture. If it has free- in its name it likely originated in Scotland as a trade guilds. Whereas Mason's worked with stones smiths worked metals into various shapes and alloys. Typically, as the trades became less prevalent or rather systems of training regarding tedious and meticulous labour was replaced by modern means which were more convenient but often at times of less quality- these guilds became philosophical and moral systems of instruction to maintain their existence.
I don't know if the freesmiths still exist but I can tell you these groups employ mentorship, using a teacher-student dynamic and most also employ degrees of initiation. Therefore, any group trying to sell you an online correspondence course that defines membership is going to be bogus.
There's also some arguments to be made that the Freesmiths and other groups coming out of metallurgical guilds, would become the stock from which the Rosicrucians (actual) were crafted.
Found some stuff on reddit if anyone else is interested
First: Apperently some guy actually bought the booklet and was invited for a fee of 1400dollars so the website sems like a dead end also the booklet apperantly has a lot of fabricated history inside (will reach out to the guy to see if i can get a bookscan)
Second: They were mentioned
Yeah that's a red-flag. These groups don't typically invite and an initiation/degree fee will never be $1,400. It sounds like someone is profiting off the name and reputation of the Freesmiths, and getting away with it as there aren't m/any left to call them out.
From what I know of the Freemasons, they also charge an initiatory fee. I don't know of many actual secret societies that don't charge fees. I mean they were originally created for the rich to have orgies </j>
You started off well then bombed. masonry did not started so that rich people could have orgies. It started as a blue-collar workers guild and did not become attractive to the upper social classes until it became mostly speculative/philosophical.
It also isn't a secret society, as the buildings are clearly marked and we are well known to our communities, rather it is a fraternal order and society with secrets. Those secrets are our ritual experience and the modes of recognition we use to protect that ritual experience.
There is a few to pay for the cost of putting one through the degrees and yearly dues to pay for the utilities and the lodges Grand Lodge dues. These are designed to be as affordable as possible and lodges are hesitant to raise dues.
In all seriousness, dues and upfront fees are common for actual initiatory societies. If not to see how serious you are, but at least to make sure you're on the hook for something.
Not directly no, but we both emerged out of Scottish work guild culture. If it has free- in its name it likely originated in Scotland as a trade guilds. Whereas Mason's worked with stones smiths worked metals into various shapes and alloys. Typically, as the trades became less prevalent or rather systems of training regarding tedious and meticulous labour was replaced by modern means which were more convenient but often at times of less quality- these guilds became philosophical and moral systems of instruction to maintain their existence.
I don't know if the freesmiths still exist but I can tell you these groups employ mentorship, using a teacher-student dynamic and most also employ degrees of initiation. Therefore, any group trying to sell you an online correspondence course that defines membership is going to be bogus.
There's also some arguments to be made that the Freesmiths and other groups coming out of metallurgical guilds, would become the stock from which the Rosicrucians (actual) were crafted.
You might also take a gander at the FreeGardeners
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Yeah that's a red-flag. These groups don't typically invite and an initiation/degree fee will never be $1,400. It sounds like someone is profiting off the name and reputation of the Freesmiths, and getting away with it as there aren't m/any left to call them out.
You started off well then bombed. masonry did not started so that rich people could have orgies. It started as a blue-collar workers guild and did not become attractive to the upper social classes until it became mostly speculative/philosophical.
It also isn't a secret society, as the buildings are clearly marked and we are well known to our communities, rather it is a fraternal order and society with secrets. Those secrets are our ritual experience and the modes of recognition we use to protect that ritual experience.
There is a few to pay for the cost of putting one through the degrees and yearly dues to pay for the utilities and the lodges Grand Lodge dues. These are designed to be as affordable as possible and lodges are hesitant to raise dues.
Actually it is because ritual and ceremony is expensive..but most lodges don't use candles anymore so at least they save money on that.
I took a look at FreeGardeners. They say they were groundskeepers for Solomon's temple on Mount Zion back when. Other sources say they started in Scotland in 1676, a time when landscape gardening was a coming thing. And one prosaic account insists they only go back to 1819. The info is sketchy as to what they do, beyond the usual "community service and brotherhood" tropes. Sort of a "We're Masons with green thumbs" ambience. Of course, being a secret society that is not surprising. On the surface, magick does not seem to be the lure. Though I guess that might come later.
I took a look at FreeGardeners. They say they were groundskeepers for Solomon's temple on Mount Zion back when.
Other sources say they started in Scotland in 1676, a time when landscape gardening was a coming thing.
Just about every free-[insertguild] had a mythopoetic Solomon's temple story. It's a fabrication just like the Idea that Freemasonry goes back to the building if Solomon's temple.
And one prosaic account insists they only go back to 1819. The info is sketchy as to what they do, beyond the usual "community service and brotherhood" tropes. Sort of a "We're Masons with green thumbs" ambience.
This discrepancy is actually to be expected. As the guilds spread out each guild was completely independent. Then, when standardization became an issue because it made it difficult for members to be tried and therefore travel, lodges began to organize we subordinate lodges under grand Lodges with regional jurisdiction.
So for example many sources will tell you that Masonry started in 1717, and while this was the beginning of the grand lodge era which shortly led to the Constitutions of modern masonry, we know the fraternity goes back to at least 1690.
So I'm not at all surprised to find two separate dates for them.
That's exactly what they are . Freemasonry but the lessons are taught threw gardening, not working with stone.
Of course, being a secret society that is not surprising. On the surface, magick does not seem to be the lure. Though I guess that might come later.
Not a secret society, a fraternity that has what used to be trade secrets. There is no magic in either Freemasonry or the Freegardners. Magic wasn't introduced into modern mystery traditions until the Rosicrucians. You wont find magic in any of our stuff. There are brothers who are occultists and magicians, and they like hiding in masonry because as practical as Masonry is with its focused on getting your mundane life in order, it doesn't attract the crazy like other orders. So yes:there are groups like Masonic& Rosicrucianism groups that pull from an existing Masonic memberlist of competent ritualists, and which do teach magical concepts... but non of these are masonry themselves or under Masonic jurisdiction.
If you want magic, just join a golden dawn revival.
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I actually had considered starting/was working on a Golden Dawn exclusively for brothers and sisters (Eastern Stars) but quickly found I was doing all the work so I put it on indefinite hiatus.
Just about every free-[insertguild] had a mythopoetic Solomon's temple story. It's a fabrication just like the Idea that Freemasonry goes back to the building if Solomon's temple.
This discrepancy is actually to be expected. As the guilds spread out each guild was completely independent. Then, when standardization became an issue because it made it difficult for members to be tried and therefore travel, lodges began to organize we subordinate lodges under grand Lodges with regional jurisdiction.
So for example many sources will tell you that Masonry started in 1717, and while this was the beginning of the grand lodge era which shortly led to the Constitutions of modern masonry, we know the fraternity goes back to at least 1690.
So I'm not at all surprised to find two separate dates for them.
That's exactly what they are . Freemasonry but the lessons are taught threw gardening, not working with stone.
Not a secret society, a fraternity that has what used to be trade secrets. There is no magic in either Freemasonry or the Freegardners. Magic wasn't introduced into modern mystery traditions until the Rosicrucians. You wont find magic in any of our stuff. There are brothers who are occultists and magicians, and they like hiding in masonry because as practical as Masonry is with its focused on getting your mundane life in order, it doesn't attract the crazy like other orders. So yes:there are groups like Masonic& Rosicrucianism groups that pull from an existing Masonic memberlist of competent ritualists, and which do teach magical concepts... but non of these are masonry themselves or under Masonic jurisdiction.
If you want magic, just join a golden dawn revival.
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I actually had considered starting/was working on a Golden Dawn exclusively for brothers and sisters (Eastern Stars) but quickly found I was doing all the work so I put it on indefinite hiatus.
