[Opinion] Coming out of the closet

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

As an occultist, with non-religious family and religious family, how do you come out of the closet as an occultist particularly to religious side of the family?
They know for the most part, but I re-dedicated myself to Christ and was re-baptized last year. But the next day, there I was doing my tarot draws and using the Great Voice to do my rituals. Staying with the non-religious side (aside from my sister), I feel like a hypocrite sometimes. I feel like an evil goon sometimes.

Until I have my own housing and income coming in, I will constantly feel like this.

On the other hand, there are a great majority of evil people (not just demonologists or satanist or luciferians or "Christians" or "Jews" or suicide bombers), but the truly evil people in this world. People that go way beyond our scope. Or maybe we on the RHP have been duped. Nonetheless, fighting the good fight, standing up for what we believe in.

Im a wierd one for sure sometimes, but I believe in the balance of dark and light, and that this world is being tipped toward the dark yet again, but not by the inquisition this time. By people more fould and heinous.
By what rights do I have to practice? To heal. To help people find their peace. To work miracles. These are what bring me joy and consolation in what I do.

But ... as a Christian, by what grounds should I stand?
What do I do when I encounter dark mages more powerful than I?
Do I have the right to do as I will?
How do I deal with opposition from each side?

 

[pixel_fortune]

Staying with the non-religious side (aside from my sister), I feel like a hypocrite sometimes. I feel like an evil goon sometimes.

I'm not Christian, and you asked for advice from Christians, so I won't comment on that

But I will say: your spiritual and religious beliefs are personal. Your magical practice is personal. Everyone has parts of their life that are just for themself, and that's healthy. You're allowed to have a private part of your life that your family doesn't know about - everyone is allowed that.

Sometimes we want to invite people in to share the things in our life that are important, but that's a choice and a gift, you're not "keeping secrets" when you choose not to share personal stuff, you're just having a private life, which everyone is entitled to.

Post automatically merged: Mar 3, 2024

(and, when you're staying with someone, that is a kind thing they are doing for you, but it doesn't mean you owe them anything other than kindness in return. There's kind of an inbuilt loss of privacy when you're staying with people the way you are, and when I've been in your position, it's been even MORE important to me to have some private stuff, to compensate)

 

[Taudefindi]

Staying with the non-religious side (aside from my sister), I feel like a hypocrite sometimes. I feel like an evil goon sometimes.

Why?

What do I do when I encounter dark mages more powerful than I?

I don't know how we can measure a person's power though, is it by their ability to influence reality more than you?But then why think that they have more power than you?Why not think you have more power than them?The mind can really be your worst or best ally in this case since magic deals with reality and our individual realities are affected by our own perception.
So if you see someone as stronger than you, it's more likely that they will be not because they are, but because you gave them power to be "above" you.

How do I deal with opposition from each side?

From those that attack you, you defend yourself.From those that have demands of you you may reach a compromise if they're open to talk.
It's all a balance act where you have to know when and how much to tip to either side.

Everyone has parts of their life that are just for themself, and that's healthy. You're allowed to have a private part of your life that your family doesn't know about - everyone is allowed that.

This exactly.

 

[stratamaster78]

I’m really not sure how to best answer because imo it feels like your practice is at odds with your religion.

Much of what we learn through Occult teachings is that the Bible is a coded book of Magick and really nothing is to be taken as literal.

I’m not bothered by anyone being a Christian… I was one myself once.

But following the Bible in a literal sense with all its trappings and guilt and being a worshipper of Christ as a Messiah makes it very difficult to move past guilt and trauma or make alchemical changes.

Having said that all I can say is that you trying to ascend the Tree is nothing for you to feel guilty about within yourself.

Practicing Divination is nothing for you to feel guilty about within yourself.

Being a Magickian is nothing for you to feel guilty about period.

Jesus was a HIGH level Magus who taught Magick to others. That’s who he was.

As far as telling your family.

I don’t know them but I’d still say this…

Be Silent

Keep your personal practice personal because chances are they will not understand whether they are Christian or not and you can’t put that toothpaste back in the tube.

I apologize if this is all over the place.

 

[Xenophon]

I figger others don't need to know. There's the old saying" "Know, Will, Act, Be Silent."

There's some chatter in Canada about electronic monitoring of those deemed "likely" to "commit hate crimes." I give it about a decade (or less) before mission-creed extends that to folks with unpopular beliefs in general. (Remember the Satanist scare of the 80's.) The closet might be the best place to be. Especially in a world where one's nearest & dearest tend to be the dime droppers.

 

[Yazata]

The title of this thread makes me be very cautious of my words and I don't want to be (too) rude but if my 50 something year old unemployed brother was living with me and said he was a witch/warlock/sorcerer/magician then I'd ask him to conjure up his own place or at least a job to pay some rent.

 

[Vandheer]

The title of this thread makes me be very cautious of my words and I don't want to be (too) rude but if my 50 something year old unemployed brother was living with me and said he was a witch/warlock/sorcerer/magician then I'd ask him to conjure up his own place or at least a job to pay some rent.

Jesus Christ bro

 

[Pyrokar]

Hit em with the "why don't you manifest some hoes"
jump back in the closet and shutting that tight

 

[Yazata]

Hit em with the "why don't you manifest some hoes"
jump back in the closet and shutting that tight

Touché. I'll go cry in the corner now.

 

[stalkinghyena]

or at least a job to pay some rent.

I have the exact same problem right now. But never mind that - I face the general indifference of "in one ear and out the other".
In spite of all the occult books and wall decorations, I do occasionally get an pseudo-interesting question like:
"Do you think voodoo is real?"
"If you got really stoned in a graveyard, do you think you would see a ghost?"
As an "explainer", I feel obligated to futility.

As to "coming out" family, there are so many religious (or non) affiliations that it's never been an issue, though my Moonie uncle did asked me if I was into "Egyptian things".

For the world at large, it's the Matrix, though I think I have cultivated "magi-dar", meaning I can generally sense who to talk to, though it would probably end up in an argument.

The only thing I really try to avoid is infection by New Agers.

 

[Pyrokar]

Don't see why you should. You are right.
it was a nuke but it's correct, in general by law we are closeted
if you have nothing to gain and everything to lose why reveal, especially when you down bad
can't two step all your life, either go full christian or don't and end of crisis.

it puts you in a position where someone who didn't know better might assume
it's just for attention. "bro im a warlock. oooooooo. i know the secret of the universe don't worry about my credit score"

i'd never willingly get out of "the closet" without motive but if someone knew or figured out on their own,
then asked for help i'd be compelled to do so to an extent, like an amulet tops.
i think it was Regardie's writing that suggested that little bit of magickal bushido

 

[Vandheer]

Fellas above are right, even if harsh.

Until I have my own housing and income coming in, I will constantly feel like this.

This right here is the root of the issue imo, and where I would focus. My guess is you would still feel guilty even if they were open arms about your practice. Bottom of the line is you need your own roof, period.

What do I do when I encounter dark mages more powerful than I?

You are so obsessed with LHP and "dark mages" its hillarious, not even people following that path discuss it as much as you do.

I mean my dude there are really bigger fish to fry than to deal with someone who shouldn't even register in their radar.

if you have nothing to gain and everything to lose why reveal, especially when you down bad
can't two step all your life, either go full christian or don't and end of crisis.

I agree. He could just devote to Christian practices.

Just be silent. Thats the only leverage you might have if pitchforks my come at you one day.

 

[Wintruz]

As an occultist, with non-religious family and religious family, how do you come out of the closet as an occultist particularly to religious side of the family?

I think a more profitable line of thought would be asking yourself why you feel the need to discuss your spiritual life with anyone at all. What is it that you're looking for others to give you? Understanding? Clarity? Acceptance? Our own rational mind has a difficult enough time understanding what's going on in at the deeper levels of our psyche. The rational mind of someone else rarely has a clue. I can understand if you're doing your own thing and someone asks "Why are you reading that?" but then "I was interested in what it had to say" should suffice if that situation ever arises.

Im a wierd one for sure sometimes, but I believe in the balance of dark and light, and that this world is being tipped toward the dark yet again, but not by the inquisition this time. By people more fould and heinous.
By what rights do I have to practice? To heal. To help people find their peace. To work miracles. These are what bring me joy and consolation in what I do.

But ... as a Christian, by what grounds should I stand?
What do I do when I encounter dark mages more powerful than I?
Do I have the right to do as I will?
How do I deal with opposition from each side?

I have read a lot of your posts in this forum since November. May I offer you some advice?

Your nets are cast far too wide and you are bringing exoteric religious programming to these issues.

The idea that Christianity is incompatible with magic, the idea of a binary between light and dark, and so on and so on, all of this belongs to a received, exoteric mindset. You can lean into that if you want to; real fundamentalists do have legitimate mystical experiences and they generate those through nothing other than love for the divine and "prayer without ceasing". If that's not an option then find and work with an esoteric Christian teacher (a Martinist group would be a good place to go) and approach them "like a little child", i.e.; totally humble yourself, forget all that you have learnt, start from the bottom and work your way up.

Whichever of those two you choose, you will not have any kind of success unless you create a kind of tunnel vision in yourself. Do not allow yourself to be distracted by anything that does not directly relate to your ultimate goal, which, if you're a Christian, should be union with God.

@Vandheer is right about you and the LHP, you have an unhealthy preoccupation with it and there's a lot about it that you misunderstand. I have known people who have taken it up with varying degrees of success. Let me save you a lot of time and energy; this path is not for you. It's "dark mages" will not be interested in you and you shouldn't be giving them any thought other than praying for compassion upon all sentient beings. If you have any LHP books, get rid of them, you're not going to need them. Don't click on the LHP forum, don't watch such videos, don't engage. Completely eliminate it from your thinking. Your preoccupation is doing nothing other than robbing you of energy that you could use for other purposes.

 

[stratamaster78]

As to "coming out" family, there are so many religious (or non) affiliations that it's never been an issue, though my Moonie uncle did asked me if I was "Egyptian things".

This just gave me a good chuckle because whenever somebody sees my Library of Books and asks about them I just say that I’m into studying Ancient Jewish, Greek, and Egyptian Arts and Sciences.

I mean technically I’m not lying.

I’m also not bringing unnecessary conflict my way.

I keep my mouth shut about all of this stuff in everyday life because I already know that no one I know IRL will understand.

 

[lolabird]

I'm inclined to agree with most people here on keeping your practice to yourself. Mainly because you don't want to invite any unwanted energies into your practice. And though they may be well meaning, they may use their "prayer" to dilute the effects of your practice (unless you have some really good protections up, but even then, it could be a challenge). Even the people in my family who are into more occult things and who know that I'm into stuff like astrology and tarot (and maybe even suspect I'm into magic) don't really know the extent of my practice. It's not that I'm necessarily worried about them knowing, but I hear enough unsolicited "Jesus talk". I'm not interested in hearing more, at least not in the way they tend to discuss it.

On the note of you feeling like some cognitive dissonance between being Christian and being occultist, I'd say maybe explore why you feel that way. I agree with @stratamaster78 in that the Bible and Christianity as a whole is a form of accepted "magic". People just don't think about it that way. I don't really think there is any inherent conflict between Christianity and the occult. So many folk and ceremonial magicians incorporate Christianity into their practice. And if you really pay attention to what some Christians say... whether they understand it or not, they're doing magic, But that's just my opinion.

All that being said, my biggest concern would be the conflict you're feeling between these two sides of yourself and less about what you choose to practice or what other people might think. Being of two minds about something seems to be a recipe for making your magic (and prayer!) less effective. I've been there, myself. On some things, I'm still of two minds. And I can very much observe how much less effective I am when I'm stuck between two opposing ideas of what I should do or think.

As for the questions at the end, here are my thoughts:

• What right do you have to practice? That's up to you. I don't think you need anyone's permission. If it brings you joy, then I think that's your answer.
• What grounds do you stand? I also think that's up to you.
• What to do when you encounter more powerful mages? It may not be that simple, but use protection magic.
• Yes, you have every right to do as you will.
• Don't worry about opposition on either side. Honestly, who cares. I suppose my perspective on this comes from being an astrologer and astrologers in more recent centuries have had religious people, scientists and even magicians on our backs at some points. Everyone and their cousin and dog has an opinion and usually a very uninformed one even about their own beliefs. I get that it doesn't make the opposition less concerning. Sometimes it makes them more dangerous, because they're operating more from feeling than understanding, and strong emotion is quite powerful. But again... I think the solution to this is getting a better handle on your own inner conflict and getting better at protecting yourself. And I think doing those two things will be create a positive feedback loop in that both will lead to you being more effective in your practice and will help keep unwanted outside influences out.

 

[Lazarus]

Are you a Christian or are you a follower of the teachings of Christ?

Matthew 6:24