Is listening to music while meditating just escapism?

[HoldAll]

So I've got a steady daily practice with empty-mind meditation at its core going for several months now. I have nothing spectacular to report so far and I'm fine with that. It would be a lie to claim that the scales have finally dropped from my eyes or anything, or that I'm experiencing a heavenly calm and divine serenity once I sit down on my cushion. My goal is to wipe the slate of my mind clean, or rather allow the slate to wipe itself clean without me interfering in any way.

I freely admit that after decades of armchair magicianship, I may come on like a purist here ranting with the fanatical zeal of a recent convert, but I feel that meditation while listening to music is not meditation at all. For me music is nothing more than a distraction, artifically inducing emotions I would not normally have, a sort of lazy trance. So of course I could experience that heavenly calm and divine serenity, given the right spaced-oout ambient sounds in the background but what would be the benefit of that? Could it really lead to genuine spiritual transformation, or is it just kicking back and chilling out? Are there real benefits in listening to music while meditating?

 

[Vandheer]

To be fair it would depend on what one is meditating on. If a person just wants to calm down whats the problem of using it?

But to control thoughts I have to agree. If it helps a person by all means they should do so, but it feels faux to me. My goal is to eventually "sit in oblivion/for even senses to disappaer while meditating". Sometimes I get a glimpse of that state. When you stop meditating it feels like you got a good nights sleep. It also feels like you are in a womb.

How am I supposed to reach there when there is music blasting my ears? I also won't have music all day, which means I should keep meditating without one so I can use the skill when I need to concentrate.

Again, by all means, people can use it if they benefit from it but it isn't my sauce.

 

[Amur]

I've overkilled music inside my own life meaning that I listen to music all the time, now as older I'm getting 'tired' of listening to music. But for ceremonies that don't need your full meditative presence I usually have music on but when I meditate I do not use music as it goes along with the clutter of the mind or emotions for that matter. To learn to meditate is to simply 'Be' or AHIH ( I Am). It's something to surf with the current inner flow that you have both emotionally and in mind.

 

[Xenophon]

So I've got a steady daily practice with empty-mind meditation at its core going for several months now. I have nothing spectacular to report so far and I'm fine with that. It would be a lie to claim that the scales have finally dropped from my eyes or anything, or that I'm experiencing a heavenly calm and divine serenity once I sit down on my cushion. My goal is to wipe the slate of my mind clean, or rather allow the slate to wipe itself clean without me interfering in any way.

I freely admit that after decades of armchair magicianship, I may come on like a purist here ranting with the fanatical zeal of a recent convert, but I feel that meditation while listening to music is not meditation at all. For me music is nothing more than a distraction, artifically inducing emotions I would not normally have, a sort of lazy trance. So of course I could experience that heavenly calm and divine serenity, given the right spaced-oout ambient sounds in the background but what would be the benefit of that? Could it really lead to genuine spiritual transformation, or is it just kicking back and chilling out? Are there real benefits in listening to music while meditating?

I have done visualizations while listening to music. (Brandenburg Concertos, Bruckner.) But for real meditation I'm a bit of a minimalist/purist like yourself. Some years ago, I spent a few months at a wat in Thailand. The monks kept mum and their ears-unbudded.(The only "music" whilst meditating was the birds, the stray dogs barking, and the tree-lizard that goes, "Oh-ohhh! Oh-ohhh! Oh-ohhh!" in the predawn hours.)

Thomas Merton rather acerbically noted that monks who "prayed while working" did neither very well. I reckon the same is true of zazen mixed with ZZ Topp. Like most multi-tasking, it makes for maladroit-maladroit results.

 

[Yazata]

So I've got a steady daily practice with empty-mind meditation at its core going for several months now. I have nothing spectacular to report so far and I'm fine with that. It would be a lie to claim that the scales have finally dropped from my eyes or anything, or that I'm experiencing a heavenly calm and divine serenity once I sit down on my cushion. My goal is to wipe the slate of my mind clean, or rather allow the slate to wipe itself clean without me interfering in any way.

I freely admit that after decades of armchair magicianship, I may come on like a purist here ranting with the fanatical zeal of a recent convert, but I feel that meditation while listening to music is not meditation at all. For me music is nothing more than a distraction, artifically inducing emotions I would not normally have, a sort of lazy trance. So of course I could experience that heavenly calm and divine serenity, given the right spaced-oout ambient sounds in the background but what would be the benefit of that? Could it really lead to genuine spiritual transformation, or is it just kicking back and chilling out? Are there real benefits in listening to music while meditating?

Years ago I got interested in the binaural beats phenomenon and divine frequencies etc.. Never really did anything for me to be honest. I also had a go a couple of times at (trying to) make my own meditation music using certain frequencies + loops of my own voice subtly over it.
But I have come to the opinion that simple silence is the best (though hardest).

As a sidenote to this: I do really like those guided meditation / path working tracks where you are taken on a journey (by a lady with a nice voice)

 

[Xenophon]

Years ago I got interested in the binaural beats phenomenon and divine frequencies etc.. Never really did anything for me to be honest. I also had a go a couple of times at (trying to) make my own meditation music using certain frequencies + loops of my own voice subtly over it.
But I have come to the opinion that simple silence is the best (though hardest).

As a sidenote to this: I do really like those guided meditation / path working tracks where you are taken on a journey (by a lady with a nice voice)

Actually, I forgot to touch on binaural beats. I found them useful in shutting out noise in some environments. There's no really quiet room where I live during the day. Bur yeah. Or maybe, no. No peak experiences.

Ladies with nice voices guiding one down paths? More than one misadventure in my life began that way, albeit not while meditating. Thus, I'm a bit leery of guided meditation. Call me paranoid. (I strongly suspect everyone else does...)

 

[stratamaster78]

I’m not sure if it’s pure escapism and I guess it depends on the person and the situation.

Just me I cannot ever be in pure silence.

I have really bad personal traumas and stone cold dead silence unnerves me and makes my anxiety worse.

I have a white noise machine running 24/7 in the background.

I also use music on top of that whenever I either meditate or perform a ritual.

If I’m strictly meditating I’m going to use music that isn’t intrusive with any kind of theme. I pick something neutral so to speak.

With ritual I’ll pick something that aligns with my purpose for that session.

I can see how it might be counterintuitive for some but I find it’s needed to get me into the proper mindset and to also aid in blocking out distractions from the peripheral.

It’s never seemingly held me back though.

 

[HoldAll]

I’m not sure if it’s pure escapism and I guess it depends on the person and the situation.

Just me I cannot ever be in pure silence.

I have really bad personal traumas and stone cold dead silence unnerves me and makes my anxiety worse.

One of the first experiences I had when starting to meditate was how frightening the Void was. No wonder we have all that chatter in our heads going all day, those glimpses of sheer nothingess can be terrifying.

 

[pixel_fortune]

feel that meditation while listening to music is not meditation at all.

I spose it depends on the type of meditation. If it's single-pointed focus (rather than empty mind or thought-noticing) then music isn't really any less valid an object of concentration than a mantra or a mandala (I'm assuming we're talking something without lyrics or hooks).

I think we would agree that you it's still real meditation if there's loud traffic noise and arguing neighbours, that you don't need to be in a silent monastery, so I think the relevant factor isn't the sound, but whether they're allowing themself to get swept away by the sound (caught up in the music or in wanting to know what their neighbours are arguing about). And you can't tell from the outside whether a meditator is staying mindful, or at least I can't, so I wouldn't feel equipped to judge.

Which isn't to say that you're not right about some people who meditate with music, just that you're not right about ALL people, and it's tricky to tell them apart

The other/related thought that makes me hesitant to agree with you is that I find it very hard to meditate with music. I don't listen to music because that makes it EASIER for me. If I'm choosing the easier option for myself, I can't be too quick to judge others for doing what's easier for them

 

[Aeternus]

I think that listening to music while meditating is a little form of escapism, but much healthier than anything else. And safer

Post automatically merged: Apr 26, 2024

Music also has ways to help us meditate like, binaural beats, white noise etc are musical ways of meditation.

 

[Tiana Silvermoon]

I agree that music can be a valid object of meditation, also it depends on your goals. When I was starting out meditations, I used music to calm a bit and concentrate on something. Now I don't need music nor it distracts me (not more than anything else at least).
But that's meditation. You just watch your thoughts and let them go, not holding on them and not letting them lead you away from just watching.
Trance is a whole other story, and here I don't see anything wrong with using music. Shamans used it for centuries to help themselves to go into a trance state, I see no reason why I or anyone else shouldn't.

 

[Mars]

Usually meditation is done with a mantra, japa or yantra, a dedicated reason why or calling. Music can be a substitute to it or help you drown out noises.
You wont be able to hear any noises from the material plane anyway once in a state of flow.

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[Pyrokar]

meditation or just vibing you say?
i see no difference.
music is meditation

would usually be enough but ofc for the contrarians it should be noted not all music is, nor are all meditation techniques
viable for everyone/every scenario
really meditating is a lot more than sitting down with closed eyes, so much that nearly anything can be called such
the main factor is being able to tell what works for you instead of trying to force it to work- and you can bet the majority is on the force it team.

 

[Mannimarco]

Meditation is such a broad term, and can have many goals. A meditation to build power is quite a different thing than an empty mind meditation. I'd say if it feels like it's not doing what you want it to, then it's probably not. Everyone's an individual, and the same person frequently has different results with the same practice at different times in their life. You could always do divination to see if a practice is having the effect you want, irregardlessof your own perception.

 

[Rowena]

...Are there real benefits in listening to music while meditating?

Well no, not if you are Listening to the music, if you are paying attention to the music then you are "kicking back and chilling out" as you put it. Not that there is anything wrong with that, taking some time to relax is never a bad thing.

As part of a meditative practice, background music should play a similar role to incense, chanting, prayer beads etc... - they are props that can function as trance state triggers once you have successfully associated them with a specific state.

Also on a practical level, music with a significant 'white noise' component - including rain sticks, rattles & burning wood - can drown-out distracting urban background noise, and if you live in a high-population area there will be a lot of that noise.

 

[theil]

Could it really lead to genuine spiritual transformation, or is it just kicking back and chilling out? Are there real benefits in listening to music while meditating?

Yes. Sacred music has been a thing for a number of years, popular with most major religions.

From my studies in hypnosis...There's different levels of trance and music helps transition from the mundane rigid ego state to a more receptive state where the subconscious mind isn't as suppressed. This allows what psychologist Stephen Gilligan calls an open field or quantum field where intuitive insights can happen. He's written a book I've studied for a while called "Generative Trance: The experience of creative flow". I believe trance can lead to spiritual transformation. There seems to be solid experiential evidence for this; dance spirit riding, holy ghost snake handlers, etc.

However, you're asking about meditation. Music might be best for contemplative meditation practices using mantras perhaps. Or...Whatever can be used to bring awareness to the current moment and allows observed thoughts/emotions to freely flow in a detached way...if certain music does that for you, then it's working.

This is a fascinating big topic and a lot of fun to study/practice.

 

[HoldAll]

However, you're asking about meditation. Music might be best for contemplative meditation practices using mantras perhaps. Or...Whatever can be used to bring awareness to the current moment and allows observed thoughts/emotions to freely flow in a detached way...if certain music does that for you, then it's working.

This is a fascinating big topic and a lot of fun to study/practice.

I agree, it all depends on what you are trying to achieve. Sure, music can help you get into a trance but would be just a distraction for me when I meditate because it is likely to produce emotions in me that wouldn't arise on their own if I simply sat in silence. What I've been always interested in is discovering in me that emotional authenticity undistorted by interpretation, thoughts, conscious analysis, etc., and music (let alone thinking) would just get in the way of this endeavour.

 

[Taudefindi]

the scales have finally dropped from my eyes

Just to say that while I shudder at the imagery of this, I really like it's meaning.
Difference in perception is a powerful thing.

I feel that meditation while listening to music is not meditation at all

Then by that logic, meditating while moving isn't meditation as well.But I meditate mostly when moving.

For me music is nothing more than a distraction, artifically inducing emotions I would not normally have, a sort of lazy trance.

I don't speak for everyone, but as someone with ADHD I feel like music is actually a good tool to help focus on a static meditation.An ADHD is very dispersed, but music helps you center your attention on something that isn't the "emptiness" of the classic meditation.It works as a focal point and you can easily ignore the lyrics of a song and focus only on it's beats(or maybe this works better for people that speak more than one language because then you can "turn off" your inner translator).

Could it really lead to genuine spiritual transformation, or is it just kicking back and chilling out?

Why it can't be both?Why spiritual transformation can only come from one source, one way?Why can't feeling peace also help with spiritual transformation?

It also feels like you are in a womb.

Got flashback to my Butoh experiences

Years ago I got interested in the binaural beats phenomenon and divine frequencies etc.

I'll be honest here...I never really bought into those.It always felt to me that if one can make so many changes to themselves just by listening to those, then why don't we have hordes of people using them and getting the changes they seek?
Just a small rant here.

I cannot ever be in pure silence.

"I" can be completely silent, but I cannot endure total quiet because then I feel like I am not paying attention to my surroundings and I feel a bit antsy at that(although I use vision most of the times, I also depend a lot on my hearing to "hear my surroundings", reason why I never use headphones when on the streets).

 

[Xenophon]

Just to say that while I shudder at the imagery of this, I really like it's meaning.
Difference in perception is a powerful thing.


Then by that logic, meditating while moving isn't meditation as well.But I meditate mostly when moving.


I don't speak for everyone, but as someone with ADHD I feel like music is actually a good tool to help focus on a static meditation.An ADHD is very dispersed, but music helps you center your attention on something that isn't the "emptiness" of the classic meditation.It works as a focal point and you can easily ignore the lyrics of a song and focus only on it's beats(or maybe this works better for people that speak more than one language because then you can "turn off" your inner translator).


Why it can't be both?Why spiritual transformation can only come from one source, one way?Why can't feeling peace also help with spiritual transformation?


Got flashback to my Butoh experiences


I'll be honest here...I never really bought into those.It always felt to me that if one can make so many changes to themselves just by listening to those, then why don't we have hordes of people using them and getting the changes they seek?
Just a small rant here.


"I" can be completely silent, but I cannot endure total quiet because then I feel like I am not paying attention to my surroundings and I feel a bit antsy at that(although I use vision most of the times, I also depend a lot on my hearing to "hear my surroundings", reason why I never use headphones when on the streets).

"Then by that logic, meditating while moving isn't meditation as well.But I meditate mostly when moving."

I'm not seeing the logic there. Meditation is focused attention. Sitting or walking, the meditator is focused on his own window of reality. The gripe against music seems to be that one is introducing an extraneous factor, one that is the work of another agent. I suppose one might say it's like letting someone else doodle on the page I'm writing. Sitting or walking, I'm sitting or walking. Add music, and I've got Lizst on my Lap and Mussorgsky on my mind. (Sorry for the fekked up boldface. I turned it on by accident and can't get out of it. Call me a sorcerer's apprentice.)

 

[Taudefindi]

I'm not seeing the logic there.

I may come on like a purist here(...)I feel that meditation while listening to music is not meditation at all.

I based that comment of mine on this comment() of HoldAll.

If listening to music isn't meditation(as classic meditation is about quietness) then technically speaking movement isn't meditation either, as classic meditation is about being in a static position(sitting).