[Help] Meditation Techniques: Good positions to keep spine straight for beginners?

[Doorman]

I started meditation, and the position I take is usualy just sitting in a little piano bench, but as time pass, I feel uncomfort and back pains.
What are some good positions you guys use for rituals?

 

[HoldAll]

Simply sitting on a cushion on a hard chair without leaning back and touching the backrest. Here is a link to the zazen file, the one in the post no longer works:

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Keeping the spine erect is really important because slumping forward will constrict your breathing. Like I said in the post, you may need to develop the muscles to maintain an upright posture first - I had that problem in the beginning as well and then again when I noticed a slight slump and corrected it not so long ago. So your discomfort is normal and will disappear over time. However, stop as soon as you experience actual pain and avoid overtaxing your body, ten minutes are enough for beginners, I'd say. Some light stretching for the back and shoulders also helps, maybe some purely mental relaxiation exercises as well.

 

[Doorman]

Simply sitting on a cushion on a hard chair without leaning back and touching the backrest. Here is a link to the zazen file, the one in the post no longer works:

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Keeping the spine erect is really important because slumping forward will constrict your breathing. Like I said in the post, you may need to develop the muscles to maintain an upright posture first - I had that problem in the beginning as well and then again when I noticed a slight slump and corrected it not so long ago. So your discomfort is normal and will disappear over time. However, stop as soon as you experience actual pain and avoid overtaxing your body, ten minutes are enough for beginners, I'd say. Some light stretching for the back and shoulders also helps, maybe some purely mental relaxiation exercises as well.

Yeah I was siting for 2 hours and was "powering" trough. My body was actuallu feeling tired from it.

 

[sherab]

In addition to what HoldAll said, one thing about sitting for long periods is to learn how to relax and calm the bodies energies. If the posture is set up properly, the bones, structure and gravity do the work rather than the muscles. A piano bench might not give the proper alignments.

 

[Altan]

You can meditate standing up. There is a static tai chi position where the knees are slightly bent, the arms bent slightly at the elbows and away from the torso, and the chin lowered to stretch the spine, feet facing forward at shoulder width. It is surprisingly free of strain. If sitting, just put a hard pillow under the tailbone to keep the back straight. You can meditate in a chair with backrest and a pillow behind the lower back if there are problems. If you can resist falling asleep, lying down works, at least for a portion of your meditation time. I meditate in bed, and even tone mantras in bed half an hour to an hour before getting up. It used to be the only way I could do mantras and not get tense. Over time, I learned to do them in other postures, or while walking, washing dishes etc. Karma yoga is based on a meditative state (a light one, but still effective) while you are going about your business. Maybe not while driving, but waiting in line or any instance where you can be impatient can certainly work.

 

[Almaveritaslab]

Hi, there are several positions to meditate that you can change from time to time and as you become more familiar with all the positions. One of the first positions is to be seated on a chair or on a cushion. The trick to meditating on a chair is to position the buttocks a little higher than the knees to bring the pelvis forward and help keep the back straight. Another position is to be on your knees, this can be difficult and uncomfortable if you do not have adequate support. Place a cushion under your buttocks and between your feet. You can also use a specially designed wooden bench, preferably with a soft cushion between you and the wood. Otherwise, your buttocks may tingle.

 

[AlfrunGrima]

A lot of people forget that it is far more difficult to sit with a straight relaxed open spine when the core muscles are weak and when in daily life the buttocks/bottom do not engage with the posture. So rather than to try it to solve when meditating I should use the meditation as diagnosis to see what was happening. The most sore and stiff muscles are needing more attention and care, they are asking you for help. And then find ways to train the core and engage the buttocks and bottom. There is a strong link between martial arts and meditation. To sit (hours) in a good meditation posture one needs a strong and healthy body which is the same in MA. It is the strong body wherein the energy flows easily, it is the strong body that gives less distraction from just being the body while meditating, it is the strong body that mirrors confidence and feelings of more capability. So train not only the mind, train the body also.

I think that in general meditation can more often be used to 'diagnose' things, from physical to non-physical things. On our subconscious level we listen in a different way to the body

I started meditation, and the position I take is usualy just sitting in a little piano bench, but as time pass, I feel uncomfort and back pains.

 

[Sedim Haba]

I find I can't sit in a lotus position, anyone else have that problem?

When I did Martial Arts I could and did kneel like this for a long time:

Once your tendons are stretched, it felt natural.

 

[HoldAll]

I find I can't sit in a lotus position, anyone else have that problem?

When I did Martial Arts I could and did kneel like this for a long time:

Once your tendons are stretched, it felt natural.

Sitting in seiza for mokusu on a hard floor can be excruciating, especially for older karateka, and you often hear their knee joints creaking once they get up again. Not being able to perform the lotus position shouldn't deter anyone from meditating, simply sitting on a chair ('god position') should be enough. I always think of the Abu Simbel statues here, if it was good enough for Ramses II, it's good enough for me:

 

[futureshop]

I forget what it’s called but it’s possible you have a curved spine which is caused from sitting. It’s quite common and can cause problems with your back muscles. I know I had it also. There is an exercise you can do to straighten your spine I also forget what the exercise is called so you might have to do a little research but all you do is. Lay on your back on a stiff surface with your knees bent and feet in the floor. And thrust your pelvis upwards. Do this as many times as your can for a few minutes and repeat everyday. You’ll be able to notice a diffference when you look in the mirror.

God bless

 

[AlfrunGrima]

I forget what it’s called but it’s possible you have a curved spine which is caused from sitting. It’s quite common and can cause problems with your back muscles. I know I had it also. There is an exercise you can do to straighten your spine I also forget what the exercise is called so you might have to do a little research but all you do is. Lay on your back on a stiff surface with your knees bent and feet in the floor. And thrust your pelvis upwards. Do this as many times as your can for a few minutes and repeat everyday. You’ll be able to notice a diffference when you look in the mirror.

God bless

Yeah, it is really a good exercise because the hips and buttocks learn how to tilt the pelvis in the right way. The exercise is used for a lot of problems. (Ischias in my case, a paternal family thing but training certain things keeps it away)

 

[deci belle]

I just lie flat on my back, or else just sit upright with relaxed shoulders in a chiar.

I can sit in full lotus, and it is an absolutely great position, but, who cares?

 

[Morell]

I forget what it’s called but it’s possible you have a curved spine which is caused from sitting. It’s quite common and can cause problems with your back muscles. I know I had it also. There is an exercise you can do to straighten your spine I also forget what the exercise is called so you might have to do a little research but all you do is. Lay on your back on a stiff surface with your knees bent and feet in the floor. And thrust your pelvis upwards. Do this as many times as your can for a few minutes and repeat everyday. You’ll be able to notice a diffference when you look in the mirror.

God bless

This is very seldom spoken about. Truly valuable note!

 

[ByAMountainOfBooks]

I always recommend the following sitting principles:

Sit on the edge
Hips higher than knees
Center of gravity is the sitting bones (not before or behind)
Placing Palms facing up on your legs
Tongue on its resting position
Chin slightly drawn in
(And if you are a man try „menspreading“ a little, takes pressure out of the lower back)

a little bit of strength in the lower and upper back as well as the abdomen helps too.

 

[Durward]

The only thing I will add, which I also do when walking and meditating, is to practice getting your shoulders up and over your rib cage towards the rear. They will rest there with practice. Chin pulled in, deep breath and relax, move your shoulders up and over the ribs towards the back, and feel it as they rest over the rear side of your body, being pulled downward by gravity.

 

[Beyond Everything]

More powerful results from meditation come from laying down. You can go deeper.

Conventional meditation leads to conventional results

 

[Swampdweller900]

It's important to remember that the sitting position, or the position of your hands, etc. is not somehow key to your meditation. Your mind and what it does or doesn't do is the most important part. Sitting, standing, walking, laying down - find a position that works for YOU where your body lets you just be, and do so comfortably.

If you sit in something like a standard cross-legged, lotus, or half-lotus position, in Zen temples people usually sit on a small and relatively firm cushion about 6 inches tall, called a zaifu. You can use a pillow from the couch folded in half or a rolled up and folded pair of jeans to get the same effect.

For sitting, you want your hips slightly forward, which is what a cushion helps you do. This makes your spine naturally curve forward just a touch, and that sort of lets your torso hang naturally. Find a cushion, stretch, and then spend a few minutes finding the right position that works for you. You should not feel any fatigue or desire to move - that's when you've found your spot. It should feel comfortable and remain that way. (Just be sure not to slouch!)

As @Sedim Haba mentioned, you can also sit in what's called seiza in Japanese. Sitting with your shins on the ground and butt on the heels. I personally prefer this for any sitting of 20 minutes and less, as it makes my legs fall asleep after that (plenty of people can sit like this for hours). You can also add a cushion in here as well. Seiza benches are also a thing, and are tiny little platforms that take pressure off your legs. If you search online you'll notice that some are leaning slightly forward to help that spine curve.

When you start, be sure to provide ample padding or support for any part of your body that touches the ground. If sitting cross-legged, maybe your ankles, or knees.

 

[Sedim Haba]

More powerful results from meditation come from laying down. You can go deeper.

This is the only way I can be comfortable now. Joints are too old for seiza now, and I never had much cushion 'back there' and now it's worse with an artificial hip.

Problem is falling asleep, of course.

 

[GreyBird]

Can you please upload the file? Thank you

 

[Beyond Everything]

Problem is falling asleep, of course.

That's actually not a problem, it's a place of many opportunities-

-Increases discipline and forcing deeper parts of you to engage in wakefulness

-Gives you the chance to master states on the edge of sleep.

-Gives you the opportunity to glimpse a whole bandwidth of thoughts, emotions- let's just say energy patterns- that you would otherwise miss if you just observed your thoughts in an alert state, or alternatively, what happens to show up in dreams.