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AI Fact-checks Modern Pagan Oppression Narratives.

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MorganBlack

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Many apologies! Saw that, but could not edit after the post.
But patronize you? Never.
In case you've not noticed, I am more than happy to usefully engage with any and all neo-religious hornets' nests. The stings, bites, and insults I endure for it are just par for the course.
 

SkullTraill

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AI is very useful as a tool initial research grunt-work and broad exploration.
This is not what most people would call “fact checking”

But agreed. Final analysis still requires humans input and meta-analysis.
It is indeed this which is what most people would call “fact checking”.

You have blasted your own toes off.

I also find that while AI is a useful tool for many purposes, people are not typically that interested in reading about what you got AI to blurt out. Especially due to the fact that AI can be engineered to say almost anything.

If you want, use AI to help you write your post, format it, spell check, check for logical fallacies and whatnot. Don’t just dump a wall of text that you massaged out of an AI. At the very least, include sources.
 

MorganBlack

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I'm old school SkullTraill , and mostly just read books.

My objective here was to spark a conversation, not to "explain" to anyone.

I don't follow WitchTok, nor AI, or occult influencers. Above I was sharing interesting datapoints of historial information, usualy missed or overlooked in the mainstream pagan narratives. So I took some of my notes I made over the years, and only used AI to create a narrative wrapper for it. Again, the information is mostly from my own research and wide reading. I thought it might be useful to some. If not, folks are free to ignore as they wish.
 

MorganBlack

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Riiiiiight.

You do you, buckaroo.
But please please don't pollute the shared intellectual commons with 1960's Boomer pagan fakelore. We're using that.
Religious hysteria just makes all poorer over time.
Post automatically merged:

Closed minded. So sad. Crack a fucking book on occasion.
 
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FireBorn

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I wonder if it would be helpful to the overall argument if you defined 'pagan Fakelore'. I understand the disdain for witchtok and trendy occult aesthetics and occult light shock vibes, but maybe if you could define what exactly you mean by pagan fakelore it might clear things up a bit?

Im hoping you aren't making light of Pagans in general. I mean there are obvious celebrations and other aspects of paganism that have been absorbed into Christendom that most might not even notice. So maybe clarity on all of this is needed.

I get why most occultists didn't burn this thread to the ground. They owe their very systems to Christianity, so of course they cant say shit.

Paganism didn't go anywhere, a lot of it just got absorbed into Christian celebrations. Syncretization is a thing.

Okay, lets not get all carried away expecting me to be mature and open minded like this all the time, but Im trying to dig into the OPs perspective for understanding.
 

MorganBlack

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I only called it fakelore (well, aside from that it actually is, by current academic consensus ) after they acted like cry-bullies.
I will not mollycoddle them. If you want to babysit, fine They already have many pagan hugboxes on WitchTok.
 

Evara

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I called it fakelore (well, aside from that it actually is, by current academic consensus ) after they acted like cry-bullies.
I will not mollycoddle them. They already have many pagan hugboxes on WitchTok.
Do better.
Quit acting like an angry child after getting called out for your nonsense.
Quit your straw manning… and quit acting like you’re some incredibly informed individual and that others would think like you do if they just opened up and read the “correct” books. 🤪

You’re clearly an Abrahamic. Your superiority complex and incoherency betrays it.
 

MorganBlack

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I am sorry to be the one to point out only a tiny amount of their low-information stuff gets any traction here.

They are the 95% loudest screaming cry-bullies, but only any 5% or less of books they like make it or stay at the top of the share book stack

In the entertainment industry, part of my role as art director is public sentiment analysis. It's a type of object oriented ontology (OOO) used to map higher ROI market segments. I tend to treat all orthodox religions, public esoteric practice patterns, magico-religions religions like Wicca, and other "faiths" even those not identified one, mostly as media preferences. I can't play favorites.

Based solely on the preponderance of types of books that float to the top of the share stack... at least when I pay attenuation to broad patterns, so not all the time - the silent majority here, even if they don't speak up, is paying attention to the much better material.

But somehow, most of the air time on these forums is taken up by these WitchTok kids.

I see you there, Evara. No need to make it personal, kid. You can already find plenty of pagan hugboxes on WitchTok.
 

FireBorn

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So what parts of Christianity are fakelore? I mean Christendom absorbed so much of Paganism to make it more attractive for conversion. What parts of Christianity (and by default parts of the occult, maybe even magickal systems) have this so called 'fakelore' in it by default according to your argument?

I am sorry to be the one to point out only a tiny amount of their low-information stuff gets any traction here.

They are the 95% loudest screaming cry-bullies, but only any 5% or less of books they like make it or stay at the top of the share book stack

In the entertainment industry, part of my role as art director is public sentiment analysis. It's a type of object oriented ontology (OOO) used to map higher ROI market segments. I tend to treat all orthodox religions, public esoteric practice patterns, magico-religions religions like Wicca, and other "faiths" even those not identified one, mostly as media preferences. I can;t play favorites.

Based solely on the preponderance of types of books that float to the top of the share stack... at least when I pay attenuation to broad patterns, so not all the time - the silent majority here, even if they don't speak up, is paying attentions to a lot the better material.

But somehow, most of the air time on these forums is taken up by these WitchTok kids.

Yes, i see you there Evara. No need to make it personal, kid. You can already find plenty of pagan hugboxes on WitchTok.
Wait, so you are using the book shares on this forum, and entertainment industry ROI market segments, and public sentiments as a baseline? Fuck dude, you should have said that at the top. I was trying to be objective here, but wow. Thank you for the clarity.
 

Evara

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I am sorry to be the one to point out only a tiny amount of their low-information stuff gets any traction here.

They are the 95% loudest screaming cry-bullies, but only any 5% or less of books they like make it or stay at the top of the share book stack

In the entertainment industry, part of my role as art director is public sentiment analysis. It's a type of object oriented ontology (OOO) used to map higher ROI market segments. I tend to treat all orthodox religions, public esoteric practice patterns, magico-religions religions like Wicca, and other "faiths" even those not identified one, mostly as media preferences. I can't play favorites.

Based solely on the preponderance of types of books that float to the top of the share stack... at least when I pay attenuation to broad patterns, so not all the time - the silent majority here, even if they don't speak up, is paying attention to the much better material.

But somehow, most of the air time on these forums is taken up by these WitchTok kids.

I see you there, Evara. No need to make it personal, kid. You can already find plenty of pagan hugboxes on WitchTok.
I don't touch social media. I quit that shit while I was deployed to the Middle East in 2012. I discovered that I liked humanity more when the internet wasn't around. The warzones acted like a hard disconnect from the modern era. It gave me perspective with how people were living their lives.
To be completely honest with you tiktok feels like a distant concept to me.
I only know that "witchtok" exists because I hear people complaining about it. If I had to guess it would be ego peddling with witch and priestess aesthetics.

This website and a few discords are the closest thing I have to an online presence...
I generally tend to keep to myself.
 

MorganBlack

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Nonetheless, WitchTok is a virulent mind virus. Your use of cliche' "pagan" slurs and insults is one of the symptoms. Now go away.
 

Evara

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Nonetheless, WitchTok is a virulent mind virus. Your use of cliche' "pagan" slurs and insults is one of the symptoms. Now go away.
This is generally how my interactions with Christians go.
First they grand stand... so I point the historical contradictions.
Then they either act superior by throwing around their preferred books or the play the victim and talk about how oppressed Christianity has been.
I call bull shit and accuse of cherry picking... which usually results in personal attacks against me.
And if I push back it's usually a dog pile. Usually resulting in me getting cast out or told to go away.

So sure... I'll walk away from you now. I know from past experiences that there's no use in arguing with drones.
And if I stick around much longer I'll accidentally end up tossing a hex at you...
And I really hate it when I accidentally hex people because it hurts them.. and then the Gods make me pull it back off...
 

MorganBlack

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So what parts of Christianity are fakelore

Pretty much all of it. Imho Jesus never existed.

Based on some evidence there was a Jewish magician about 200 BCE named Yehusha, and whose stories were used as the basis of the Christian myths. But it also doesn't matter. Gods don't need to have ever been alive to be quite 'real'.

--------------------

That's good, Evara. I'm a magican, and you are playing in my world. Not me in yours.
 

Evara

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Pretty much all of it. Imho Jesus never existed.

Based on some evidence there was a Jewish magician about 200 BCE named Yehusha, and whose stories were used as the basis of the Christian myths. But it also doesn't matter. Gods don't need to have ever been alive to be quite 'real'.

--------------------

That's good, Evara. I'm a magican, and you are playing in my world. Not me in yours.
If you're so confident...
I dare you you to throw a curse at me... with all you've got. Put your back into it, boy.
 

FireBorn

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I can see how it can turn into a really sticky topic here. I do wonder though, how much Paganism that was synchretized and landed in the magickal systems many use today.
 

MorganBlack

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Evara, you have done nothing to me that would justify me attacking you with wrathful daimons. I am sorry you feel otherwise.
 

Evara

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Evara, you have done nothing to me that would justify me attacking you with wrathful daimons. I am sorry you feel otherwise.
I just surrounded you with mirror curses and placed curse trip mines to trigger in your direction if you make a move towards me.

And if you send your daimons my way expect them to never return. I will tear their souls to pieces and entomb their shattered fragments in obsidian prisons where their souls will be dissolved and they will be no more.
 

MorganBlack

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Paganism that was synchretized and landed in the magickal systems
Evara, feels nice. Thank you, sweetie.
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Fireborn,

I think tons! Like all of it, originally! 90% of Catholicism is literally Paganism. (I can support that, but giant topic) The Protestants are not wrong. But don't tell the Catholics nor the pagans.

But originally it almost all it came from the Mediterranean region, Egypt and Greece , and near east, like Syria... see the Babylonians, Chaldeans, Zoroastrians, and NeoPlatonists.

The people in the frozen northern lands did not add much. They came much later on as the tradition was communicated northwards. But they did not create the core of the Western Magic Tradition. Aside from their local shamanic practices, which I think are great. But they did not have the foundational stuff that capital 'M' Magic used... like astrology, nor often an alphabet, nor mathematics. etc. This stufff is Star Lore that becomes Time Lore that becomes Star Demons under a Time God - that become X-tianized.

That said we can totally support and cheer when the British Cunning Men (and women), the continental Cyrpianic sorcerers, and the Icelandic rune magicans take the stuff and localize it in their cultures. Like, rock on! . But they came much much later than the core of the tradition , and the late-stage effort to "own" all of it is a-historical.

That said. I like alot of their takes. I have my own,. but I would never try to re-con it backwards in time like they do.
 
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