[Help] Building psychic skills?

[pixel_fortune]

Please read before giving advice: my situation isn't the typical one. At least read the sentence in bold.

So my visual imagination is fine. I can picture a grandfather clock, to use the classic example. I can imagine the smell and taste of an apple and the sound and texture when I bite in into it

But I'm not very good at sensing presence of entities/energies etc.

What I have is decent controlled imagination, but bad spontaneous imagination. So if you say "imagination an angel", I can. But if you say "this angel has a gift for you, a symbolically important object. What is it?" then it won't be anything, because I need to choose what to imagine - my brain rarely just generates images without prior instructions. (This lack of spontaneous imagination is a common feature of alexithymia btw, some brain architecture thing I think)

I'm decent at divination with tarot and a pendulum, but not with scrying - which I think involves a certain amount of collaboration with your spontaneous imagination

I've looked up advice for improving these skills (eg Mat Auryn's Psychic Witch) but they're always exercises in controlled imagination - imagine the smell and taste of chocolate, of a black rose, etc. But I already have that skill. It's not what's missing.

So I'm not sure what else to try, other than brute force practice.

(I suspect a lot of occultists became interested in the occult because they had spontaneous psychic type experiences, so they by definition have a natural high level of "perceiving the subtle" talent, and may not have ever thought about how to build it. Whereas I got here via just thinking about it and figuring stuff out, not because of experiences)

I'm using "psychic" narrowly, I don't mean telepathy or telling the future, just sensing the invisible

Post automatically merged: Feb 8, 2024

I think the above would also help with astral journeying, which I'm not good at it unless it's planned. (I can work in my astral temple, because I decided everything that would be there. But not going into unknown places)

 

[Tiana Silvermoon]

I realise this all makes me sound kind of thick but it honestly doesn't come up that much. People who know me IRL are surprised when I tell them this.

Not at all. I know a handful of artists with aphantasia, I realize it's not exactly the same, but these are people who can't imagine a picture in their head and still draw amazing stuff, so not having a spontaneous imagination doesn't tell anything about your abilities.

 

[HoldAll]

Not at all, it's quite a specific problem that's hard to explain clearly

That was a hypothetical example, but for journeying I have done: nothing, and then eventually my mind wanders to some mundane thing because it's hard to stay focused on a static scene indefinitely

In general, in daily life, I'm terrible at improv or generating ideas on the spot. A lot of my friends are performers and are great at that stuff, but I'm a writer: I need to go away with a pen and paper and think for a while before I can come up with something. (I realise this all makes me sound kind of thick but it honestly doesn't come up that much. People who know me IRL are surprised when I tell them this.)

Just uploaded the shamanic book. And no matter what Google says, I think it's impossible to teach oneself to be more spontaneous, and even if that was possible, such a behavioural trait wouldn't necessarily translate 1:1 into the kind of imaginative faculty you're after. Kudos for having the discernment to distinguish between willed experiences and genuine ones - I think that a lot of people are just LARPing, impatient and desperate to follow the traditional narratives of occult lore subconsciously simply to have any kind of occult experience.

I sometimes jokingly say to myself that I refuse to believe in the objective reality of angels, demons, etc. until one of them bit me in the ass and all the pictures fell from the walls (which would be even more miraculous because there are no pictures on the walls), so I'm in a somewhat similar situation in that I'm still waiting for some genuine, unscripted experience. My usual strategy for solving such a problem is mulish persistence which is clearly not yours, or so I have gathered from your posts. Still, keeping at it while trying new methods may be the best course here.

 

[Taudefindi]

In general, in daily life, I'm terrible at improv or generating ideas on the spot

Reason why I recommend doing some theater/acting classes, or asking from your performer friends some exercises of improvisation they must do.
You can also give a try at playing TTRPG.

And if everything else fails, you can try the old method of "sudden spontaneity", just go with your daily life but along the way make sudden choices different from the ones you're used to doing.It doesn't have to be anything big, it can be as small as "I always walk this route, today I'll walk a different one(that will still bring you to where you want to go)", or "I am left/right-handed, why not try to write/draw with the opposite hand for a while?", or even "I will put the milk first and then the cereal, like a heretic!".

Small inconsequential changes that will change even a little your life, they might end up growing into bigger changes but that's up to you.The more different stuff you do, the more you will slowly get used to "improvising".It might not seem like that but trust the process.

Post automatically merged: Mar 20, 2024

I think it's impossible to teach oneself to be more spontaneous

It's not impossible, but it most likely won't work as people think with the person suddenly becoming "oh I wanna do that!" on the spot, most likely they will start doing small things suddenly that to others might not seem that big of a change but to them it is a change.Being spontaneous has many layers, but the one people know the most is the one of the person that says "yes" to everything in order to try new things in life, that's being radical.

such a behavioural trait wouldn't necessarily translate 1:1 into the kind of imaginative faculty you're after

I'm of the mind that enacting small changes might help someone to develop their thinking patterns, expanding them and in the end helping them grow as a person.It's a little by little process though.

I think that a lot of people are just LARPing, impatient and desperate to follow the traditional narratives of occult lore subconsciously simply to have any kind of occult experience

Really?Is it that rare to have any kind of experience?
I don't know, despite being a natural born skeptic I've been through some stuff that proved me the existence of the occult, and to me it seems like going through said events are more normal than people think.It's just that they want to focus a lot on the bigger stuff(the "hardcore" experiences)that they tend to ignore the smaller(seemingly inconsequential)ones.

BTW, what are these "narratives of occult lore" you mention?

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

The Ciceros present psychic skills trainging in their Self Initiatation book. ESP cards are mentioned later, but the psychic skills are presented before or during Neophyte grade, definitely before Zelator grade. I think the ESP cards are suggested after Neophyte or Zelator.
Personally, Ive found psychic testing via tarot to help, I believe I wrote a post on it.
Sensory deprivation and sleep deprivation for 72 hours can trip psychic occurences.

 

[Taudefindi]

ESP cards

Zener cards?

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

Zener cards?

Yep, I think so.

This may help with tarot cards:

[Tutorial] - Psychic Testing via Tarot

This uses three levels or methods of senses, using a standard 78 card Tarot deck. The purpose is to decease error, and lead to success. Rollercoasting at the phase Im in is normal, and remember we win some we lose some. Dont be afraid to alter the method is one method is not working. The three...

wizardforums.com

 

[HoldAll]

BTW, what are these "narratives of occult lore" you mention?

I mean that their experiences often follow the ones described in books or other people's stories so that they tend to stay within the confines of occult traditions, e.g. when they compulsively cloak their supernatural impressions of certain forces in anthropomorphic representations because they are so desperate to get visuals, so to speak, but if they were radically honest, they would have to admit they were just feeling an indistinct presence.

I admit that it's a fine line. On the one hand, you do visualisation exercises where you're supposed to imagine an angel with clearly defined attributes, for example, on the other you're told to let go of any expectations you may have when conjuring a spirit. What I was criticizing here was the tendency to give one's astral impressions (traditional) shapes they don't actually have due to peer pressure and impatience. Maybe it's a personal thing - I would ask myself over and over again: "What is really there?" because I'm afraid to deceive myself.

 

[pixel_fortune]

My usual strategy for solving such a problem is mulish persistence which is clearly not yours, or so I have gathered from your posts.

It's a tough call. On the one hand - don't give up the second something's difficult. On the other hand - If you're good at picking locks, you shouldn't keep trying to hammer doors down with your fists. Something being really difficult can just mean your tactics are dumb. The trick (which I haven't mastered) is knowing when you're being lazy vs. boxing clever.

What I was criticizing here was the tendency to give one's astral impressions (traditional) shapes they don't actually have due to peer pressure and impatience.

Frater Acher was talking about this a bunch in a Glitch Bottle. Are the Goetia spirits really tied down to the strengths given in the grimoire, or have they just been typecast? He reckons: keep an open mind about what their skills might be and what sort of work they might like to do. (Makes sense to me, but I don't do any of that kind of work so who knows)

 

[HoldAll]

There is a quote from an old grimoire somewhere (it might be even the Goetia, I forget) according to which every Goetia demon can do the things others can do as well. Anyway, the Goetia is not for me, those spirits are simply too unpredictable and most importantly not safe for me to conjure, I feel, other practitioner's mindsets are probably much better suited for the demonic world.

 

[Aeternus]

There is a quote from an old grimoire somewhere (it might be even the Goetia, I forget) according to which every Goetia demon can do the things others can do as well. Anyway, the Goetia is not for me, those spirits are simply too unpredictable and most importantly not safe for me to conjure, I feel, other practitioner's mindsets are probably much better suited for the demonic world.

I agree with you. The forces are unpredictable and there needs to be a very strong mind in order to work with such forces.

Like you have said, it is not for everyone!

And Goetia spirits can easily break the circle if the will (mind-force) of the practitioner isn't strong enough.