[Help] Can you do both Right and Left side magic?

[TraffyLawwhereVee]

TLDR: has there been a person that did right and Left side with no problems?

Is there a restriction to one side only?

 

[Ben Gruagach]

Humans like to create classifications for things. It's one of the ways we try to understand the world around us.

Some classification systems are based on very simplistic two options. The "left hand" and "right hand" classification is one example of this. And like any limited classification system it might look nice and tidy but breaks down when you try to impose it on real life which is rarely ever so nice and tidy.

And what do we mean by "right hand" and "left hand" anyways? Do we mean "right hand" equals "good", "helpful", and "left hand" equals "bad", "harmful"?

Take a healing for example. For the patient that is suffering, being healed would definitely be considered "good". But look at it from the point of view of the microorganisms (bacteria, virus, whatever) that is causing the illness -- to them having the patient healed usually means killing the microorganisms. So to the microorganisms the healing would definitely be "bad".

Or look at a specific tool such as a knife. The knife could be used to cut food, to carve a piece of wood into a useful item. That's "good", right? But that same knife could be used to injure a living being, perhaps even to kill them. That's "bad", right? So is the knife "good" or "bad"? (Can a knife be "good" or "bad"?)

Magic is a tool, just like a knife. You can use magic for "good", and you can use magic for "bad". Specific spells can also be used for both "good" and "bad" -- it all depends on your perspective, and what your goals are.

It's no different when you use the labels "right hand" and "left hand" for a practice, a spirituality, or for spells and magic.

 

[Amur]

Well I use both LHP and RHP techniques for my consciousness. So why couldn't it be done? For example assume a God-form is very LHPish. And deification of the ego is also again very LHPish. There are lots of techniques for both. Besides I'm a christian Satanist who doesn't worship anything but the reflection of God.

 

[Jsinclair]

I would suggest that to intend such a thing is to establish the Foundation of The Great Work itself.

As for doing it with "no problems"....only if one were to read that question as "No" Problems, per Thelemic understanding of the word No.

 

[SamaelCrowe]

You’ll find many opinions out there. I’m going to be straightforward with you, and I won’t tell you what you want to hear: the answer is no.

Why not? Because the Left-Hand Path (LHP) is based on claiming your own power and achieving self-deification. The magic of the LHP arises from within you.

In contrast, on the Right-Hand Path (RHP) you subordinate yourself to the power of others — you ask them, you beg them, you implore them to help you. It is the complete antithesis.

You cannot walk one path as a self-sufficient being and the other as a subordinate to an external God.

 

[PinealisGlandia]

It's called the Middle Path. I've also heard it called the "narrow path" less frequently. The body has two hands, and practitioners of the Middle Path like myself would say that you're cutting yourself off from one side of your being if you focus on one side while starving the other.

You’ll find many opinions out there. I’m going to be straightforward with you, and I won’t tell you what you want to hear: the answer is no.

Why not? Because the Left-Hand Path (LHP) is based on claiming your own power and achieving self-deification. The magic of the LHP arises from within you.

In contrast, on the Right-Hand Path (RHP) you subordinate yourself to the power of others — you ask them, you beg them, you implore them to help you. It is the complete antithesis.

You cannot walk one path as a self-sufficient being and the other as a subordinate to an external God.

You haven't thought about this deep enough. The ultimate synthesis of the LHP is recognizing the divinity of others that is the same as your own. The ultimate synthesis of the RHP is recognizing that the ultimate power of divinity you see in the external world is present in your innermost self. At the bottom of either well, you find the other. In the this is symbolized by the white in the black and the black in the white.

 

[SamaelCrowe]

You haven't thought about this deep enough. The ultimate synthesis of the LHP is recognizing the divinity of others that is the same as your own. The ultimate synthesis of the RHP is recognizing that the ultimate power of divinity you see in the external world is present in your innermost self. At the bottom of either well, you find the other. In the this is symbolized by the white in the black and the black in the white.

The ‘ultimate synthesis’ of the Left-Hand Path is not to dissolve into a universal recognition that ‘we are all divine in the same way.’ That sounds like a Right-Hand Path trap disguised as depth: a dissolution of the self into a cosmic unity or a false spiritual equality that weakens the individual will.

The true synthesis of the LHP is to become the god of your own temple, not to dissolve yourself into a universal brotherhood of ‘stars’ that the majority will never manage to ignite. And it is through self-deification that one ascends, grows, and obtains power — not by deifying others or begging favors from external gods.”

 

[Amur]

The ‘ultimate synthesis’ of the Left-Hand Path is not to dissolve into a universal recognition that ‘we are all divine in the same way.’ That sounds like a Right-Hand Path trap disguised as depth: a dissolution of the self into a cosmic unity or a false spiritual equality that weakens the individual will.

The true synthesis of the LHP is to become the god of your own temple, not to dissolve yourself into a universal brotherhood of ‘stars’ that the majority will never manage to ignite. And it is through self-deification that one ascends, grows, and obtains power — not by deifying others or begging favors from external gods.”

Ain Soph Aur is 1. This Ain Soph Aur is Infinite as well as 1. It goes into everyone and everything. What you are looking at in the LHP spectrum is just a reflection of this 1. Which is by what I meant with the reflected God. Deification of the ego seems to bring some results inside one's own psychic sphere but it can also be used in the wrong way. Assuming a God Form is the best way to not have a brush with ego in the wrong way. Because there is nothing good in Bloating the Ego so that it's a God. Assuming a God Form is safest and you can banish it back to Void.

If you start deifying other programs then assuming a God form doesn't work either. It needs to be your own prime number inside the Ain Soph Aur to get things working, if you start to worship someone that reached their own prime number then it goes to waste.

 

[boymatmat]

I honestly don’t think it’s as black-and-white as some people make it sound. Historically, plenty of practitioners blended systems that today people would label “RHP” and “LHP” without seeing them as mutually exclusive categories.

I think both can coexist, but balance and clarity matter a lot. If someone is constantly pulling themselves in completely opposite directions philosophically or spiritually, it can create confusion fast. But working with different currents responsibly? I don’t think that’s inherently a problem.

A lot probably comes down to maturity, stability, and understanding why you’re doing what you’re doing rather than just collecting systems and applying their frameworks randomly.

 

[Googoodoll]

Well I use both LHP and RHP techniques for my consciousness. So why couldn't it be done? For example assume a God-form is very LHPish. And deification of the ego is also again very LHPish. There are lots of techniques for both. Besides I'm a christian Satanist who doesn't worship anything but the reflection of God.

If you get time, would you mind elaborating a little on deification of the ego?

 

[Amur]

If you get time, would you mind elaborating a little on deification of the ego?

Well it's a bit like using an upright Matter over Spirit Pentagram instead of using a Spirit over Matter Pentagram. So it goes along with those lines. But sure anyone can tamper with their ego how they want. I can boost up certain qualities of yourself that you want to bring into the corresponding ritual.

 

[TraffyLawwhereVee]

For example assume a God-form is very LHPish. And deification of the ego is also again very LHPish.

I came across the deification aspect when scrolling through the forums. I'd like to know if it's like (gosh this is gonna be a lil nerdy reference but..) the manhua's "boundless necromancer" or " I'll be taking a personal reasons break". Both pieces discuss how they earn powers of a God through a system. I'm not saying it's like your practice but I'll go through and check it out more extensively.

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I would suggest that to intend such a thing is to establish the Foundation of The Great Work itself.

As for doing it with "no problems"....only if one were to read that question as "No" Problems, Thelemic understanding of the word No.

you had me in the first half then you lost me. I'm curious if their would be any backlash or conflict in the spiritual world of such practices are attempted by a practitioner.... I obviously need to read up on more on Thelemic philosophy beforehand before I can even conjure any form of Ideas first.

 

[PinealisGlandia]

The ‘ultimate synthesis’ of the Left-Hand Path is not to dissolve into a universal recognition that ‘we are all divine in the same way.’ That sounds like a Right-Hand Path trap disguised as depth: a dissolution of the self into a cosmic unity or a false spiritual equality that weakens the individual will.

The true synthesis of the LHP is to become the god of your own temple, not to dissolve yourself into a universal brotherhood of ‘stars’ that the majority will never manage to ignite. And it is through self-deification that one ascends, grows, and obtains power — not by deifying others or begging favors from external gods.”

Why do you use quotation marks when you're not quoting? You can change the entire meaning of a sentence by omitting a single word, as you did.

I never suggested dissolution. I suggested... Well, I suggest watching the movie "I Huckabees",

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.

The temple is your body, so unless you're particularly daft, you should be able to grok that those other temples you see are housing gods in their own right. The fact that you intend to continue beyond the death of the temple and believe it is possible is your belief in those other gods, because who blazed the trail you're following if not for another spirit?

The middle path is simply being a god among gods, which is the simple inescapable truth of both the LHP and the RHP. Again, you'd have to be particularly daft to be on a forum of LHP practitioners claiming you're the only one in existence capable of actually achieving self-deification, and I'm not accusing you of being that daft. Recognizing the divinity in others is simply a high-level application of empathy, and if in all your practices of self-deification you've never found the utility of empathy (be it at a high or low level), I feel validated in my initial assessment that you haven't been thinking deeply on these topics. Next time you're called upon to meditate, meditate on the utility of empathy.

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I'm curious if their would be any backlash or conflict in the spiritual world of such practices are attempted by a practitioner....

"Spiritual world" is just an old timey way of referring to the unseen parts of the world, which we now use terms like cosmic rays, ultraviolet/infrared spectrum, fields and such to describe. You could think of it as overlapping with this world, but it's really cleaner to understand that it literally is this world. The reason it's unseen is because the brain has developed a shortcut of filtering out >99% of information because the unconscious hasn't been taught to think of it as "important". That's why so many spiritual practices boil down to "practice mindfulness" or "bring your awareness back to your breathing" or "chant this phrase over and over again until your brain stops chattering". Slowing the mind down leads to accessing more information, and over time that becomes an "open third eye".
I strongly believe that in the future, medical science will come to understand that the pineal gland is not a "vestigial organ" as modern literature refers to it and is actually a functional parietal eye that is sensitive to different wavelengths than the two primary eyes.
So as far as backlash or conflict...
Your risk is about the same as it is with any course of action, honestly. Arguably less than if you pursued either path exclusively (which at this point, when you're asking about both paths, aren't you already taking an interest in both paths? If there's a spirit out there to "get you" if you pursue both the LHP and RHP, you've already attracted its ire with this thread!). There's an old american indian proverb that often gets misquoted. Say you've got a wolf that represents your desire to give to the community, and a wolf that represents your desire to provide for yourself. They're both your wolf, and if you only feed one, the one you starve will wait for a distraction so that it can steal food. That's the RHP and LHP in american indian culture.
The two paths build off of each other and depend upon each other. Someone who only provides for themself will suffer from lack of relations. Someone who only gives to others will suffer from lack of having enough to give. You have to build yourself up to have something to give, and if you have nothing external to build, you'll lack the commitment to continue working on yourself. That's why in the

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material, it's said that Service to Self entities exist at up to the sixth dimension and Service to Others entities can be Service to Self entities when operating at dimensions below the seventh.
In the long term, you'll never suffer any consequences, conflict or backlash that is meaningful. But when I say "the long term", I'm taking the view of someone who's got a lot of past life memories and doesn't talk about reincarnation as a hypothetical, but as a point of fact. You could totally suffer consequences that last a lifetime. But like, that's part of the journey, man. It's possible that taking this path will lead to you recognizing someone in your life isn't someone you want to keep in your life, giving you the "consequence" of a lifetime without that person in it. Which might make you sad sometimes, while making you happier on average. Or you might quit a job because the values don't align with yours anymore, and have the "consequence" of a job hunt or business venture as a result.

I'd like to know if it's like (gosh this is gonna be a lil nerdy reference but..) the manhua's "boundless necromancer" or " I'll be taking a personal reasons break". Both pieces discuss how they earn powers of a God through a system.

I haven't read those particular stories, but I've read a few stories in the vein and I'll put it bluntly: The more systematic the explanation for "how things are" someone gives you, the more of their own personal spin (cough*bullshit*cough) you're getting with the explanation. It's not that they're intentionally misleading you, per se, it's just that they overestimated what percentage of the total picture they understood. Even the wisest among us all put together barely crack 1% of all there is to know, and sometimes when someone learns something that not a lot of people know, they feel like they found the missing 99%. Let me put it this way: Newton and Einstein both understood gravity differently than each other, neither of them understood gravity completely, and no one alive has understood it completely well enough to explain it to someone in a way that could be repeated. Gravity, which is technically more omnipresent than air. Now take that basic lack of understanding we have about something that is omnipresent and apply it to everything else because if we know we don't understand gravity, how can we be confident we understand anything else?
So I encourage you to broaden your horizons. Consider how "social engineering" as a term for how you can get into almost any part of almost any building by just carrying a ladder might be a modern framing for what was more classically called an "invisibility cloak" or "the invisibility siddhi". What I'm saying here is, understand that there's a magic in everyday things, and that just because we can explain it, that doesn't make it not magic. It just makes us a society of wizards . Have you ever considered how candles are so omnipresent in magic because they represent the first technology? Controlled fire!
Ultimately, there's as many systems as people. Even if you take a Great Teacher (capitalization given sarcastically) and read their books like cookbooks, following the recipes exactly, you will experience something different from the Great Teacher, and the Great Teacher knew that when he wrote the book. And over half the Great Teachers never wrote anything down! You know how many oral traditions there are? That's what I love about this website. One out of three of the posters on this website could be a Great Teacher if they just had a ghostwriter and a publisher, the forum preserves the oral tradition through the essay. The key to personal growth is to synthesize.
Oh thank God, I wrote myself to a concluding thought.
The key to personal growth is to synthesize.