[Opinion] Changing the external physical world via magick

[Jk666]

from my experience most ppl do magick
to change themselves to ascend.

but if I wanna physically externally change the world for crowds of ppl how should
it be done?

if we assume this world is just an illusion,
then why is it so hard to manipulate
on a macro scale?

I think it’s cuz of tech that restricts the
possible in this world: cameras watching
comm tech connecting ppl over large distances etc

the 3 major religions were established when
ppl were more gullible & there was much less tech around.

I wonder: can we have the best of 2 worlds-
the tech 1 & the magical 1?

should large scale macro changes in a short period of time be possible like the parting of the red sea / or it would make the world too chaotic?

is magick too elitist /tech democratic?

what other questions can u think of?

 

[hungry_ghost]

if I wanna physically externally change the world for crowds of ppl how should
it be done?

The goetia. Specifically spirits who teach rhetoric.

You have to be the change you want to see in this world and people will follow suit. Given how we're all connected by the internet and can easily influence each other through social media, I think rhetoric is the single most powerful tool you can use as a magician if you want to change the world.

 

[Mider2009]

What change do you want?

We are in the world of the physical so we are ruled by the laws of physics, supposedly some sages could mess with the laws kinda like how a programmer sees the code and can mess with it

 

[Roma]

if we assume this world is just an illusion,
then why is it so hard to manipulate
on a macro scale?

Whose illusion is it?

Perhaps the human operator has to be profound to over-ride the owner of the illusion

As well, the owner of the illusion may be decided some rules to be embedded in the illusion

 

[Jk666]

What change do you want?

We are in the world of the physical so we are ruled by the laws of physics, supposedly some sages could mess with the laws kinda like how a programmer sees the code and can mess with it

I want there to be other intelligent life besides humans on earth. I want more nature less cities concrete crowds groupthink

I don’t want man to lord over nature & disrespect women/other living things.

I want less tech/engineering/pollution

I want for man’s footprint to shrink.

I want a magical world of wonder
not a world where every shmuk can
buy a car/gun have kids & propagate his
stupidity

i also take issue with entropy death aging

this world is not exactly heaven,
so let at least for evolution to continue..

 

[Jk666]

Whose illusion is it?

Perhaps the human operator has to be profound to over-ride the owner of the illusion

As well, the owner of the illusion may be decided some rules to be embedded in the illusion

i think it’s a shared illusion of all living things

is god the owner? No there’re many gods entities dark lords sources

maybe there was a god but he split to several entities timelines & spaces so u can change the rules

 

[Roma]

so u can change the rules

How have you gone with that?

 

[Jk666]

How have you gone with that?

I tried changing time cuz it’s mostly in our heads.

I had trances where time moved very slowly

space I could not change

 

[Roma]

It may be that the human is embedded in a galactic system with its own rules

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

from my experience most ppl do magick
to change themselves to ascend.

but if I wanna physically externally change the world for crowds of ppl how should
it be done?

if we assume this world is just an illusion,
then why is it so hard to manipulate
on a macro scale?

I think it’s cuz of tech that restricts the
possible in this world: cameras watching
comm tech connecting ppl over large distances etc

the 3 major religions were established when
ppl were more gullible & there was much less tech around.

I wonder: can we have the best of 2 worlds-
the tech 1 & the magical 1?

should large scale macro changes in a short period of time be possible like the parting of the red sea / or it would make the world too chaotic?

is magick too elitist /tech democratic?

what other questions can u think of?

I would think chaos would reign since at every level of experience, there might be a battle of wills with what each side desires to manifest.
Either that or the chaos would be from everyone trying to figure out whats occurring.

 

[Mider2009]

I want there to be other intelligent life besides humans on earth. I want more nature less cities concrete crowds groupthink

I don’t want man to lord over nature & disrespect women/other living things.

I want less tech/engineering/pollution

I want for man’s footprint to shrink.

I want a magical world of wonder
not a world where every shmuk can
buy a car/gun have kids & propagate his
stupidity

i also take issue with entropy death aging

this world is not exactly heaven,
so let at least for evolution to continue..

That’s possible yup...but not easy

 

[Öwnchef]

Maybe you want to go for anything Mishpat. In other words use a good judgement. There is a high chance that you will try to change the physical world of others, e.g. me. And an even higher chance that I (or others) will find out and come after you. If your work is disliked, that is. So stay with Mishpat.

Just saying.

 

[Sage]

if we assume this world is just an illusion,
then why is it so hard to manipulate
on a macro scale?

My main theory is that the "collective unconscious", led by all the biases enforced through the ages(and stil in this age), works as a kind of "wall" or "sponge" that absorbs the individual's will and stops it from defying the collective belief(which in this case would be that "humans don't have power to change their destiny/Humans don't have the power of gods/Humans can't change their reality").

I wonder: can we have the best of 2 worlds-
the tech 1 & the magical 1?

Magic and tech are, more or less, different sides of the same coin.In the end, it's the understanding of both that ends up giving one knowledge on how to use them, and how to use them well.

Plus, I bet that many things we have today would have been seen as "magic" by the people of old times(e.g. lasers).
It's all a matter of time, progress and understanding.

 

[Konsciencia]

I want there to be other intelligent life besides humans on earth. I want more nature less cities concrete crowds groupthink

I don’t want man to lord over nature & disrespect women/other living things.

I want less tech/engineering/pollution

I want for man’s footprint to shrink.

I want a magical world of wonder
not a world where every shmuk can
buy a car/gun have kids & propagate his
stupidity

i also take issue with entropy death aging

this world is not exactly heaven,
so let at least for evolution to continue..

What I've learned, is that you need to see this Physical World as a Spiritual World. You have to make peace with it. Otherwise, how can One be at peace with him/herself?

 

[Ancient]

My main theory is that the "collective unconscious", led by all the biases enforced through the ages(and stil in this age), works as a kind of "wall" or "sponge" that absorbs the individual's will and stops it from defying the collective belief(which in this case would be that "humans don't have power to change their destiny/Humans don't have the power of gods/Humans can't change their reality").

In the paradigm of an observer-created universe, you are correct. The will of the masses upholds expectations of reality, and an individual’s or small group’s intent would not be able to overpower this collective will.

Magic and tech are, more or less, different sides of the same coin.In the end, it's the understanding of both that ends up giving one knowledge on how to use them, and how to use them well.
Plus, I bet that many things we have today would have been seen as "magic" by the people of old times(e.g. lasers).
It's all a matter of time, progress and understanding.

I disagree with this. While much of our technology would seem to possess magical capabilities to a less advanced culture, I think it is important to distinguish between these two. We may one day end up understanding the physical machinations of magic, but our inventions are strictly physical. Magic comes from the creative source of the universe which is also the source of our awareness. It comes from life. Although we get closer and closer to simulating life, artificial intelligence will always be just that.

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

from my experience most ppl do magick
to change themselves to ascend.

but if I wanna physically externally change the world for crowds of ppl how should
it be done?

if we assume this world is just an illusion,
then why is it so hard to manipulate
on a macro scale?

I think it’s cuz of tech that restricts the
possible in this world: cameras watching
comm tech connecting ppl over large distances etc

the 3 major religions were established when
ppl were more gullible & there was much less tech around.

I wonder: can we have the best of 2 worlds-
the tech 1 & the magical 1?

should large scale macro changes in a short period of time be possible like the parting of the red sea / or it would make the world too chaotic?

is magick too elitist /tech democratic?

what other questions can u think of?

This goes back to a question from one of my posts, what exactly are the schools of Magick?
White Magick
Witchcraft
Wicca
Root Magic
Candle Magick
Sigil Magick
Natural/Elemental Magick
Zodiacal/Celestial Magick
Sorcery
Low Magick
High Magick
Hoodoo
Voudoo
Black Magick
Demonology
Angelology
Dimensional Magick
Time Magick
Alchemical Magick
Tantric Magick
Islander Magick
Contagion Magick
Sympathetic Magick
Imitation Magick
Shamanism
Druid Magick
Dragon Magick
Celtic Magick
Norse Magick
Islamic Magick
Prayer/Qabalistic Magick
Hermetic Magick
Mysticism and Meditation Magick
Deva Magick
Freemason Magick
Satanic Magick
Luciferian Magick
Death Magick
Healing Magick

Do some of these overlap? Of course. But each of these can be studied as the only form.
So, branching off from Hoodoo and Hermetic Magick, I'm trying to see where I can fit in, Mysticism, Qabalistic Magic, advanced Hermetic Magick perhaps. Or Low Magick and Celestial Magick.

 

[hungry_ghost]

This goes back to a question from one of my posts, what exactly are the schools of Magick?
White Magick
Witchcraft
Wicca
Root Magic
Candle Magick
Sigil Magick
Natural/Elemental Magick
Zodiacal/Celestial Magick
Sorcery
Low Magick
High Magick
Hoodoo
Voudoo
Black Magick
Demonology
Angelology
Dimensional Magick
Time Magick
Alchemical Magick
Tantric Magick
Islander Magick
Contagion Magick
Sympathetic Magick
Imitation Magick
Shamanism
Druid Magick
Dragon Magick
Celtic Magick
Norse Magick
Islamic Magick
Prayer/Qabalistic Magick
Hermetic Magick
Mysticism and Meditation Magick
Deva Magick
Freemason Magick
Satanic Magick
Luciferian Magick
Death Magick
Healing Magick

Do some of these overlap? Of course. But each of these can be studied as the only form.
So, branching off from Hoodoo and Hermetic Magick, I'm trying to see where I can fit in, Mysticism, Qabalistic Magic, advanced Hermetic Magick perhaps. Or Low Magick and Celestial Magick.

You're being too dogmatic in your approach. I understand labeling things is important but I think you're missing the point.

And you forgot typhonian vampire magick

 

[Jk666]

You're being too dogmatic in your approach. I understand labeling things is important but I think you're missing the point.

And you forgot typhonian vampire magick

I agree I do chaos magic & it doesn’t have an exact definition: I define it for myself when I do a magical act in the moment.

but I’m an eclectic magician, so the definition changes every time.

 

[Sage]

from my experience most ppl do magick
to change themselves to ascend.

Both magic and religion seems to have a similar focus in this area, the difference is the means.

but if I wanna physically externally change the world for crowds of ppl how should
it be done?

No one can 100% say how the world(or reality) works for sure, all we can do is speculate and think that each of us have the right answer.

I personally believe that there is one all encompassing existence/"reality", shared by all since we all came from the all(and I use this term not to mean a deity, but "something" that has too many names), we're the drops from the ocean, on our own but still borne from the same source.

But even though we "share" the same space, in the end we each have our own individual personalities and those colour and change our perception of reality.
We might try to influence the perception of others, but at the end of the day our own perception is the one telling us how the world/reality is.So, it is hard to just accept different just because someone "has a different view of it".

Because we only have our own perspective to base ourselves in, even if we try to understand the perspectives of others.

It's like taking one frame from a movie, picking a scene but rotating it towards a different angle. That tends to change the dynamic and weight of it, being able to even change the meaning of the scene itself.

But it is still the same scene from the same movie, you just saw it from a different perspective.

Now try to explain this to those that did not saw this...it's hard.

if we assume this world is just an illusion,
then why is it so hard to manipulate
on a macro scale?

I think that there might be due to the "collective unconscious", since people mostly agree that something is impossible, the weight of this unconscious decision made by billions is much harder to break if you're a single consciousness.

Maybe there are people out there, powerful enough to surpass the C.U., but I can't say for sure.

People are already "used to it", to these chains, so whenever someone rises against these, they don't even have to pull them down again.Just ignoring their attempts to break free is enough for the chains to weight more and more.

In a way, it feels like a fish going against the current.

It is extremely hard and honestly, there is no guarantee that it will be worth the effort.

On the other hand, I think that people are going the wrong way about it.

But enough digressing, this has already become a wall of text.

 

[Jk666]

But enough digressing, this has already become a wall of text.

I see good ideas here

I think the corona is the catalyst for physical external change meaning a lot of ppl r dying & we don’t even know most of them they’re just not counted in the dead.

i believe there must be a price paid for changing this c.u. & it’s very steep