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I'd like to know everyones experience with evocation. It can be anything from sensations to visual appearances.
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Experiences With Evocation
- Thread starter SovereignJames
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Evocation has 2 main types, evocation where the summoned being can be perceived by people who have not trained their subtle senses, and where the being summoned can be perceived with only the subtle senses.
The first type mentioned here is normally only done by people who are as of yet untrained and want to prove to themselves magic is real, but the skills for that are typically beyond them. I've used this method a couple of times to prove magic was real to people. it's more dramatic than changing the weather normally, but it's easier to do with entities already close to our world. full sight and sound are achievable, even then the spirit is almost never flesh and bone like we are, but a much denser energy form
The 2nd type of preferred by most trained practitioners I know, it is significantly less effort/energy, and you can more easily summon things farther out from us.
The third option is imo the best way, in which you project yourself to the spirit instead of asking/forcing it to come to our world. However, you have to be very careful here. You don't want to do this with anything that could be hostile toward you, or that you don't know the rules of interaction with them and could possibly offend them.
The first type mentioned here is normally only done by people who are as of yet untrained and want to prove to themselves magic is real, but the skills for that are typically beyond them. I've used this method a couple of times to prove magic was real to people. it's more dramatic than changing the weather normally, but it's easier to do with entities already close to our world. full sight and sound are achievable, even then the spirit is almost never flesh and bone like we are, but a much denser energy form
The 2nd type of preferred by most trained practitioners I know, it is significantly less effort/energy, and you can more easily summon things farther out from us.
The third option is imo the best way, in which you project yourself to the spirit instead of asking/forcing it to come to our world. However, you have to be very careful here. You don't want to do this with anything that could be hostile toward you, or that you don't know the rules of interaction with them and could possibly offend them.
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While they are not my thing, i hear modern simplified magic 'transvocation' techniques work , but I can't speak to that personally.
I'm a grim trad magician who has been using the Grim Verum for many years. I like to use either simple conjuring, using Hoodoo / Brujeria techniques - or the spirit conjuring of trad magic.
In my experience, for what trad spirit conjuring looks like in practice, I made a post about here:
wizardforums.com
Historically most spirit conjuring down in the village probably looked like the simple conjure / brujeria / folk magic approach. See the link above. I've included there another hyperlink to another post on what that looks like .
I'm a grim trad magician who has been using the Grim Verum for many years. I like to use either simple conjuring, using Hoodoo / Brujeria techniques - or the spirit conjuring of trad magic.
In my experience, for what trad spirit conjuring looks like in practice, I made a post about here:
Author - Jason S. Black’s notes from 'Pacts with The Devil' (1993)
The macro-level topic here might be 'Shifting into a Daimonic Universe.' More below. I'd been meaning to post these excerpts from the early 1990's book Pacts with the Devil (by S. Jason Black & Christopher S. Hyatt, Ph. D., New Falcon Press, 1993) as the evocatory bookend to the simple but...
wizardforums.com
Historically most spirit conjuring down in the village probably looked like the simple conjure / brujeria / folk magic approach. See the link above. I've included there another hyperlink to another post on what that looks like .
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Yeah, these bad ideas need more calling out.
In 2004 Joseph Lisiewski published book with a cool cover but which was literally called 'Ceremonial Magic & The Power of Evocation', and basically made a fetish out of full visible evocation, saying unless you have full visible manifestation, you would lose control and BAD STUFF would boomerang on you.
It put off many people from diving into the grimoires for many years! (We know now from reading Stavish the dude had really serious and unresolved anger issues - so OF COURSE he got the angriest and most hostile manifestations.)
Too much fetishism. And it goes both ways.
The famous oracles of the Temple of Delphi used a pendulum hung from a tripod of hazel over a bowl and to communicate using simple divination. Now everyone makes a fetish of mental communication.
So of course the counter reaction to Lisiewski has been to make a fetish of mental trance channeling. All good, but sometimes it smears into the same missionary zeal as Lisiewski's.
To me it look like all the of these useful practices that have all be historically employed by service magicians and Cunning folk (thanks to Dr. Al. Cummins for that history) have now been sliced off from each other, compartmentalized , and are being sold as the One True Technique. It ALL works, so just get moving, I say. But it does not all work the same.
I will vouch for the practice of evocation as a personal marker of you own mythic engagement.
It is not required for "slow sorcery' , but I can tell when my personal ego and "small mind"personality are still over-involved, and giving me stereotypical manifestations. The more you go into the mythic journey the more Other they become, and the more extreme the experience becomes and 'fast sorcery' becomes more possible. But also not necessary.
What's the rush? Unless its a real emergency, slower sorcery is probably better in most cases. The faster it is the more is can be a bit wild and chaotic as reality breaks.The classic Hoodoo timeline is a good rule of thumb. Just have patience. (I remind myself. I have a very direct and punchy Cardinal sign on my Ascendant. Go! Go! Go!)
In 2004 Joseph Lisiewski published book with a cool cover but which was literally called 'Ceremonial Magic & The Power of Evocation', and basically made a fetish out of full visible evocation, saying unless you have full visible manifestation, you would lose control and BAD STUFF would boomerang on you.
It put off many people from diving into the grimoires for many years! (We know now from reading Stavish the dude had really serious and unresolved anger issues - so OF COURSE he got the angriest and most hostile manifestations.)
Too much fetishism. And it goes both ways.
The famous oracles of the Temple of Delphi used a pendulum hung from a tripod of hazel over a bowl and to communicate using simple divination. Now everyone makes a fetish of mental communication.
So of course the counter reaction to Lisiewski has been to make a fetish of mental trance channeling. All good, but sometimes it smears into the same missionary zeal as Lisiewski's.
To me it look like all the of these useful practices that have all be historically employed by service magicians and Cunning folk (thanks to Dr. Al. Cummins for that history) have now been sliced off from each other, compartmentalized , and are being sold as the One True Technique. It ALL works, so just get moving, I say. But it does not all work the same.
I will vouch for the practice of evocation as a personal marker of you own mythic engagement.
It is not required for "slow sorcery' , but I can tell when my personal ego and "small mind"personality are still over-involved, and giving me stereotypical manifestations. The more you go into the mythic journey the more Other they become, and the more extreme the experience becomes and 'fast sorcery' becomes more possible. But also not necessary.
What's the rush? Unless its a real emergency, slower sorcery is probably better in most cases. The faster it is the more is can be a bit wild and chaotic as reality breaks.The classic Hoodoo timeline is a good rule of thumb. Just have patience. (I remind myself. I have a very direct and punchy Cardinal sign on my Ascendant. Go! Go! Go!)