How is the subtle plane really perceived? My working model, and I'd love to hear your experiences

[ROL13]

Hi all. For a while now I've been studying and practicing perception of the subtle plane, comparing authors such as Josephine McCarthy, Jerry Alan Johnson, Henry Corbin and Jung. I'm less interested in theory than in what practitioners actually experience, so I'm sharing the model I've arrived at. Feel free to confirm it, challenge it or take it apart:

1. There is an intelligent subtle plane "out there", inhabited by beings with their own agendas who are, for the most part, indifferent to us.
2. This plane interacts with us in quiet ways: synchronicities, opportunities, intuitions. Never so spectacular that it couldn't also be explained rationally.
3. It usually isn't seen. It's felt, as a presence.
4. There is a more tangible level of interaction, but it requires an inborn gift plus perceptual training.
5. Even then, that level always happens in a liminal or imaginal state: a blend of imagination and real perception.
6. It's easy to mistake this for a controlled hallucination. For me, the best subjective validation is surprise: perceiving something you didn't expect and didn't build yourself.
7. With the physical eyes, perception would only happen out of the corner of the eye, through peripheral vision. If something is "seen" head-on, or in human form, I suspect it's the brain projecting from the subconscious.
8. Finally, I don't see it as external in a physical sense. It's accessed through the subconscious, and it's the mind that gives it form and "life" when it interacts with the physical world.

I'm especially interested in concrete experiences:

• Have you ever perceived something head-on, with a defined form, fully awake and without any substances?
• How do you tell a genuine contact apart from your own imagination?
• After years of practice, did your perception become clearer, or did it stay subtle?

Thanks in advance for any experiences or thoughts you're willing to share.

 

[Nembra]

Well, I can't agree to this hypothesis mostly because it doesn't agree with my theory on the same subject which does a better job explaining it.

More seriously though, there are some things I can point at directly. First thing that comes to mind, surprise is a feeling, therefore it can be hallucinated. Even that aside, your unconscious mind contains more things you would be terrified to learn about than you have memories. Not to even mention: presence is a feeling, therefore it can be hallucinated.

Another truism is, if something can actually be explained in certain way then it is sufficient to explain it that way. If the "subtle realm" exists then it creates some irreducible difference within the world. If it doesn't cause or meaningfully descriebe anything then it can be fully ignored with no loss.

 

[Helios Arcana]

I’d like to add something: in some herbalist folk traditions, the physical appearance of a plant is indicative of its magickal (subtle) properties. So, for example, a plant with thorns may be used for protection. In Brazil, Dracaena trifasciata (also known as the snake plant or Saint George’s sword, because it resembles a sword) is planted for protection and to ward off evil.
This relates to the Hermetic principle of “as above, so below.”

 

[kazuriel01]

Hi all. For a while now I've been studying and practicing perception of the subtle plane, comparing authors such as Josephine McCarthy, Jerry Alan Johnson, Henry Corbin and Jung. I'm less interested in theory than in what practitioners actually experience, so I'm sharing the model I've arrived at. Feel free to confirm it, challenge it or take it apart:

1. There is an intelligent subtle plane "out there", inhabited by beings with their own agendas who are, for the most part, indifferent to us.
2. This plane interacts with us in quiet ways: synchronicities, opportunities, intuitions. Never so spectacular that it couldn't also be explained rationally.
3. It usually isn't seen. It's felt, as a presence.
4. There is a more tangible level of interaction, but it requires an inborn gift plus perceptual training.
5. Even then, that level always happens in a liminal or imaginal state: a blend of imagination and real perception.
6. It's easy to mistake this for a controlled hallucination. For me, the best subjective validation is surprise: perceiving something you didn't expect and didn't build yourself.
7. With the physical eyes, perception would only happen out of the corner of the eye, through peripheral vision. If something is "seen" head-on, or in human form, I suspect it's the brain projecting from the subconscious.
8. Finally, I don't see it as external in a physical sense. It's accessed through the subconscious, and it's the mind that gives it form and "life" when it interacts with the physical world.

I'm especially interested in concrete experiences:

• Have you ever perceived something head-on, with a defined form, fully awake and without any substances?
• How do you tell a genuine contact apart from your own imagination?
• After years of practice, did your perception become clearer, or did it stay subtle?

Thanks in advance for any experiences or thoughts you're willing to share.

I am certain that the subtle plane is connected to the subconscious, but it is by no means only the subconscious; I view it through a combined model of energy and mind. Otherwise, if we could connect solely with the subconscious, we would be able to influence external events by giving ourselves suggestions through self-hypnosis—yet we cannot; self-hypnosis allows us to influence only ourselves.

 

[Frater M.M.]

Hi all. For a while now I've been studying and practicing perception of the subtle plane, comparing authors such as Josephine McCarthy, Jerry Alan Johnson, Henry Corbin and Jung. I'm less interested in theory than in what practitioners actually experience, so I'm sharing the model I've arrived at. Feel free to confirm it, challenge it or take it apart:

1. There is an intelligent subtle plane "out there", inhabited by beings with their own agendas who are, for the most part, indifferent to us.
2. This plane interacts with us in quiet ways: synchronicities, opportunities, intuitions. Never so spectacular that it couldn't also be explained rationally.
3. It usually isn't seen. It's felt, as a presence.
4. There is a more tangible level of interaction, but it requires an inborn gift plus perceptual training.
5. Even then, that level always happens in a liminal or imaginal state: a blend of imagination and real perception.
6. It's easy to mistake this for a controlled hallucination. For me, the best subjective validation is surprise: perceiving something you didn't expect and didn't build yourself.
7. With the physical eyes, perception would only happen out of the corner of the eye, through peripheral vision. If something is "seen" head-on, or in human form, I suspect it's the brain projecting from the subconscious.
8. Finally, I don't see it as external in a physical sense. It's accessed through the subconscious, and it's the mind that gives it form and "life" when it interacts with the physical world.

I'm especially interested in concrete experiences:

• Have you ever perceived something head-on, with a defined form, fully awake and without any substances?
• How do you tell a genuine contact apart from your own imagination?
• After years of practice, did your perception become clearer, or did it stay subtle?

Thanks in advance for any experiences or thoughts you're willing to share.

I'm not sure if this is what you're asking about but I had a very strange experience when I went to spiritualist church for a short healing session:

I was lying on my back on a sort of raised cushioned bench and a woman healer was doing hands on healing over me. It was pretty strong and I kind of "tranced out". My eyes were shut but I wasn't dreaming (lucid or otherwise). I suddenly had a feeling that there was something behind me like a presence. I sort of leaned up on my forearm and twisted my head round to have a look but at the same time a part of me realised I was still lying flat on my back. I was surprised to see this tall male (all white) figure with a long stylised wing I guess -- It was like a long diagonal line going down the floor (from his shoulder) and then it curved back up to join his shoulder. Then I noticed there was like this black buzzing fog over my throat and he stepped up and beamed down white light from his palms onto it to erase it. Finally, I was jolted "awake" by the woman healer placing a hand me shoulder.

Just a couple notes. I had no expectation of seeing anything, let alone a winged entity. I've never experienced anything like that before. It was also nothing like hypnagogic imagery or lucid dreaming which I've had before. It was like a dual existence on two different levels. The final jolt by the woman healer was almost like the collapse of this existence back into a single one again.