Risk of Cancer in the Magical Arts

[Nerone]

Hello Friends,

I have not seen this addressed in the late-antiquity, medieval or the renaissance stuff I've been reading.

But there are some serious practitioners post the 19th Century Occult Revival who to insist that some of these practices can have a detrimental effect on health. Like Robert Amberlain who claimed that the Shem angels weren't all that love and light with extreme malevolent effects, or Paranormal Researches being of a heighten risk of cancer as a group in general.

I've heard this before, from a serious practioner for hire who claimed that many people who went about spirit working the wrong way got brain cancer.

What's up with that?

 

[levi777]

spirit working the wrong way as you said it, yes its correct, then someone can harm not only his phyisical but and his mental health!!!

 

[Nembra]

With brain cancer in particular the opposite causal link seems far more likely.
I'd say that, while on paper not impossible, it's quite unheard of for magical practice to cause sickness of the body. It can, however, damage the mind itself or promote habits that ultimately do lead to bodily ailments - and it's not even in all cases a matter of doing it "correctly" or "incorrectly".

 

[WonderFire]

Paranormal investigators rarely use protections and even more rarely cleanse. They also stick their noses into darkest pits they can find- which is fine, but you have to cleanse and banish afterwards and make sure nothing followed you home.
You're not going to get brain cancer from working "wrongly" (whatever the hell that meant in that context). Your inner talent is more likely to twist you, but it's not a given.

 

[Morell]

Hello Friends,

I have not seen this addressed in the late-antiquity, medieval or the renaissance stuff I've been reading.

But there are some serious practitioners post the 19th Century Occult Revival who to insist that some of these practices can have a detrimental effect on health. Like Robert Amberlain who claimed that the Shem angels weren't all that love and light with extreme malevolent effects, or Paranormal Researches being of a heighten risk of cancer as a group in general.

I've heard this before, from a serious practioner for hire who claimed that many people who went about spirit working the wrong way got brain cancer.

What's up with that?

Sounds like a great way to prevent competition in the field.

I do not think that these people have any higher risk of cancer basing on this kind of work. Though that it is not completely safe is quite correct.

Paranormal investigators rarely use protections and even more rarely cleanse. They also stick their noses into darkest pits they can find- which is fine, but you have to cleanse and banish afterwards and make sure nothing followed you home.
You're not going to get brain cancer from working "wrongly" (whatever the hell that meant in that context). Your inner talent is more likely to twist you, but it's not a given.

I agree.

Bringing malevolent spirits with you from such places is real problem, that has to be dealt with.

 

[ahathoor]

"Paranormal investigator" is a weird postmodern occupation; looking at what these people do, involve themselves with, think and believe, well I wouldn't one bit be surprised if this was actually true. Of course there's always the chance it's just confirmation bias.

I guess there's a certain "approach" to the spiritual or daimonic that i have observed seems to "eat people" in various ways... encountering it has always given me feelings similar to having opened a refrigerator of literally rotting meat and maggots, and it's not even just limited to "dark and edgy" demonolator types... in fact i've experienced it most frequently in the axis of "white light" new age / paranormal / spiritism worlds... like honestly the moment i see a bloody ufonaut with a fucking halo my breakfast wants to come back... no shade of course on anyone, lol

but magic in general... nah, i don't think so, if you keep your balance... i guess don't do shit that feels icky? stay away from "teachers" who feel off... don't play stupid games, you won't win stupid prizes...

 

[Horologer]

This risk is genuinely present in some practices. Those who practice a technique known as rebirthing tend to have the shortest lifespans. It was very popular in Eastern Europe.

 

[Beyond Everything]

From what I've seen and researched, many occultists die younger than average. It doesn't seem to matter what variety they are, either.

This risk is genuinely present in some practices. Those who practice a technique known as rebirthing tend to have the shortest lifespans. It was very popular in Eastern Europe.

Rebirthing was at one time marketed as a way to achieve physical immortality, ie Leonard Orr.

 

[Horologer]

From what I've seen and researched, many occultists die younger than average. It doesn't seem to matter what variety they are, either.


Rebirthing was at one time marketed as a way to achieve physical immortality, ie Leonard Orr.

I knew many rebirthing practitioners in Eastern Europe, and quite a few of them passed away relatively early from cancer. For some reason that I never quite understood, the main hub of the rebirthing community in Eastern Europe was in the small Ukrainian town of Izmail, near the border with Moldova.

 

[Beyond Everything]

I knew many rebirthing practitioners in Eastern Europe, and quite a few of them passed away relatively early from cancer. For some reason that I never quite understood, the main hub of the rebirthing community in Eastern Europe was in the small Ukrainian town of Izmail, near the border with Moldova.

What happens is it resurfaces traumas and other 'negativities', and then instead of energetically dealing with them, they just continue the breathing. This doesn't actually 'clear' those thoughtforms, and their detrimental effects impact the person. This is actually a huge issue with many meditative practices, but you'll never hear it discussed.

 

[ahathoor]

From what I've seen and researched, many occultists die younger than average.

Arguably, many famous people die significantly younger than average... if i think of the occultists I personally know and have known, i haven't noticed a marked divergence from what one would expect based on their lifestyles.

Those who practice a technique known as rebirthing tend to have the shortest lifespans

From a cursory search I wouldn't touch that particular egregoric current with a ten foot pole... exactly the sort of stuff that just smells off...

that said I wonder about the quality of statistics, what with Chernobyl and confirmation bias, and people in poor health probably more likely to seek out such practices.

 

[solxyz]

that said I wonder about the quality of statistics, what with Chernobyl and confirmation bias, and people in poor health probably more likely to seek out such practices.

Right. We should really be asking: how many high-quality studies have actually been done on the lifespans of these very niche subcultures (paranormal investigators, rebirthers) or of occultists in general. I'm willing to bet the answer is close to zero.

 

[Horologer]

First of all, the people who work with geopathogenic zones are the ones who die of cancer most often. For example, Galperin, the most famous Eastern European magician of the late 20th century, died of cancer while investigating a geopathogenic zone in Yugoslavia.

The second reason is that there are techniques for eliminating rivals by means of cancer. These techniques were openly taught at various courses for psychics back in the 1990-2000s. And they work as well.

Although there are rare exceptions. In Odesa, there was an old man, Psychic, who died of old age about five years ago. He was able to work with cancer patients with remarkable ease, even in the most severe cases, and he was well known to many people...

 

[Robert Ramsay]

The way I look at it, cancer is an example of a scaling event. That is, a single, crucially placed, mutation can cause a single cancer cell, which then multiplies up and there you are.

Magic works by taking advantage of scaling events - your thoughts scale up to differences in events, which are meant to lead to your intention.

Magical acts also produce side-effects - you may notice other coincidences around your successful act, like ripples from a thrown stone. This is why banishing/cleansing is a good idea, to try and steer away from unforeseen negative consequences.