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Absolutely!
Its because too much is too available too easily imo.
The current generation takes it for granted and dont appreciate how lucky they are. We would find old books and treasure them and drink the words, though ultimately find our way through the dark with actual practice. Slow and steady repetition. Now the youngsters just jump through advanced content and do the practice and it seems slapdash.
Like martial arts. One would spend so much time mastering basic technique that when more advanced technique came the basic technique was a part of us. Now its gungHo and its mass consumption of occult literature, without the essential mastery of basic occult principles and practices. Or so it seems..
Three things can be observed at the heart of all magical acts, be that sorcery, witchcraft, magic or as result of prayer or any other types ritual.
Mind (1) generates thought that (2) moves energy and (3) results in action.
There are many ways that this can be actualised by employing various different mechanical processes. When carefully considered, it becomes rather clear that behind all such occult-based magical acts, that may indeed often appear very different at face value, the fundamental principles at work reveal that this statements universally true. We all naturally realise how fundamental the understanding of energy is to a would be mystic or magician, as it is the expression of potential and the very manipulation of this very potential, is what defines a magical act from a mundane one.
Here's Why Energy Matters
There are only actually three fundamental states, as the alchemists of antiquity well knew and, these three act in seven ways. For each acts independently, each with the other and all together in synchronised fashion. Thus a, b and c = can act upon anything in the following seven ways =as a, b, c, a+b, ,a+c, b+c or a+b+c. Thus are distilled into the seven fundamental principles at the heart of Hermetics, Vedic Chakric systems, the seven principles of Kemetic spirituality derived from the attributes of the ancient Egyptian goddess Ma'at : truth, justice, harmony, balance, order, reciprocity & propriety, the seven principles of Middot as relates to Kabbalah, the seven principles of the Dao- Qu, Pi, Ziran, Yang-Yin, Wu-wei, De & the Dao or Tao. and the list goes on.
Though fundamentally this seven tiered system of understanding is related to the three planes of existence, three worlds of the shaman, namely: the Astral, Etheric and Causal realms respectively that represent the three fundamental states from whence the seven principles arise to begin with, it serves as an excellent way to understand the esoteric workings hidden in the occult shadow of the worlds formation.
The Causal "realm" or field of pure transcendence experienced abstractly as inspired thought.
The Astral "realm" or field of pure energy experienced as the qualities we consider abstractly as emotions and feelings.
The Etheric "realm" of field of form that we experience abstractly as ideas or thoughts.
These latter two are essentially a division of the Causal field that interact as do the twin serpents of Caduceus, Yang Yin or the spiral of Kundalini's ascent and descent between the chakras that produces the experience of changing qualities bound in adapting forms. Its all essentially the same idea presented in different ways and we call this time. with the three states representing the present, past and future, where the present polarises as the past becomes the future.
How these seven divine principles of Correspondence works through Polarity to manifest Cause andEffect as an expression of Vibration bound by Rythm that defines the Generative coupling that embodies in perfect preportion, the fundamental state of Mentalism, is yet another conversation. One that shall indeed come at a later stage. Suffice to say that these three fields of manifestation we have been discussing, that are behind this world and even begets this world, are essentially those of Thought, Energy and Form.
Energy thus stands between form aand thought, for as thought vibrates to the point that it gets expressed as energy, the very movement of that energty then then defines form as result of the effects that cause effects along the causal chain that structures space as time, producing the outcome of matter we experience as result.
The Hermetic Principle Of Polarity
When considering the cosmogony of how time and space evolve from pure thought, one can recognise that pure thought in all its abstraction started to produce vibration. This Vibration, the 3rd principle of Hermes, thus required a sense of movement in order to exist in its own right, for thats what vibration is. Vibration is essentially, mechanical ocilating waves around an axis. Cosmogenically speaking, that axis is the principle of Mentalism, or puere abstract thought that is not linear, ie Hermes 1st principle. The pattern of the oscilation consists of a field of Correspondence between the two waves- Hermes 2nd principle. Fundamentally the notion of vibration suggests movement and thus there is a definable range of movement implied. This "range of movement" expressed through the act of vibration is an actualised field of Polarity- Hermes 4th principle. Polarity is the potential expressed in any dynamic exchange of movement and is the source tapped to produce said movement in the first place, whereby the potential energy becomes kinetic energy and produces acoustic resonance as result.
Thus the polarity principle governs all energetic systems and is at the heart of how energy behaves and similarly acts as the source from whence it arises while defining its behavior. Duality is the currency of polarity and it embodies the substantial allocation of its bounds, as it defines the very process it embodies. All that new-age nonsense about non-duality is thus, from an occult perspective, essentially vomit, as it denies the nature of existence as it is in favour of adopting a theoretical ideal that is insubstantial and unobtainable while being alive. Sure there is a point where such isnt relevant, but thats not within the domain of an energetic system, such as the systems in which we find ourselves, be that physical or transcendent. Polarity reflects the 2nd principle of Correspondence and defines the Principle of Cause and effect, acting as an energetic bridge between the mental and physical states of being we experience.
The generative principle of gender is how polarity actualises itself in matter and thus carries the same somewhatly less abstact symbolic definition, whereby sometimes the one muight seem an expression of the other.
We can see how Polarity is defined as the union between the poles as a system that defines the process of interaction between these two nones.
Its mystic essence of two poles is thus a systemic reflection of the actualised third principle that defines the nature of relationship between these.
Hence the mystic character of Polarity is understood as emboding vibration of number 2 fundamentally, however its actual character reflects the vibration of the number number 3.
Below can be seen how the vedic and daoist systems treat these principles, so as to illustrate the uniform representation accross different cultural landscapes.
Yang (masculine) + Yin (feminine) = Dao (path from & to source) represent the forces that manifest the world and traverse the meridians of the body.
Pingala (masculine) + Ida (feminine) = Sushumna (path from & to source) represent the three above principles as they animate the body and the world via the nadi's.
As above so below (Hermes 4th Principle) maintains that the Dao contains within it the forces of Yang & Yin, as does the Sushumna contain within it the Ida & Pingala.
The Dao & Shushumna represent the diverse unity as considered "above" in Hermetics, as the Yang-Yin & Pingala-Ida pairs represent the unified expression of multiplicity "below"
I just wanted to say that I genuinely enjoyed reading what you wrote. I really appreciate the amount of thought, research, and effort you put into connecting all these different traditions. I honestly find that kind of thinking fascinating, especially the way you look for the underlying patterns rather than just taking each system at face value.
And honestly, I think it's a shame when someone puts that much time and thought into sharing something with a community, only to be met with sarcasm. People don't have to agree with every part of your theory, of course, but I think sharing an idea openly and giving others something to think about is valuable in itself.
You seem like someone I'd genuinely enjoy talking with and learning from. I've been exploring a lot of these subjects myself, and I'd be very happy to stay in touch and exchange ideas sometime if you're open to it. I'd consider it a pleasure to have you as a friend
I just wanted to say that I genuinely enjoyed reading what you wrote. I really appreciate the amount of thought, research, and effort you put into connecting all these different traditions. I honestly find that kind of thinking fascinating, especially the way you look for the underlying patterns rather than just taking each system at face value.
And honestly, I think it's a shame when someone puts that much time and thought into sharing something with a community, only to be met with sarcasm. People don't have to agree with every part of your theory, of course, but I think sharing an idea openly and giving others something to think about is valuable in itself.
You seem like someone I'd genuinely enjoy talking with and learning from. I've been exploring a lot of these subjects myself, and I'd be very happy to stay in touch and exchange ideas sometime if you're open to it. I'd consider it a pleasure to have you as a friend
I just wanted to say that I genuinely enjoyed reading what you wrote. I really appreciate the amount of thought, research, and effort you put into connecting all these different traditions. I honestly find that kind of thinking fascinating, especially the way you look for the underlying patterns rather than just taking each system at face value.
And honestly, I think it's a shame when someone puts that much time and thought into sharing something with a community, only to be met with sarcasm. People don't have to agree with every part of your theory, of course, but I think sharing an idea openly and giving others something to think about is valuable in itself.
You seem like someone I'd genuinely enjoy talking with and learning from. I've been exploring a lot of these subjects myself, and I'd be very happy to stay in touch and exchange ideas sometime if you're open to it. I'd consider it a pleasure to have you as a friend
Thank you so much! It’s lovely to be connected with you too, and sending warm blessings back to you!
I’m based in Vietnam, quite far from Cape Town geographically, but I’m glad the internet makes it possible for people with similar interests to connect regardless of where we are.
I’d love to exchange ideas and learn from each other. If you’d like, you can reach me privately at [email protected] It would be lovely to continue our conversations there.
And being by a Penguin Sanctuary in Cape Town sounds wonderful!
Absolutely!
Its because too much is too available too easily imo.
The current generation takes it for granted and dont appreciate how lucky they are. We would find old books and treasure them and drink the words, though ultimately find our way through the dark with actual practice. Slow and steady repetition. Now the youngsters just jump through advanced content and do the practice and it seems slapdash.
Like martial arts. One would spend so much time mastering basic technique that when more advanced technique came the basic technique was a part of us. Now its gungHo and its mass consumption of occult literature, without the essential mastery of basic occult principles and practices. Or so it seems..
You obviously put alot of thought into this coment
Though you could possibly try a little harder and possibly explain the "Gen-Alpha shorthand"?
That would make more sense..
You obviously put alot of thought into this coment
Though you could possibly try a little harder and possibly explain the "Gen-Alpha shorthand"?
That would make more sense..
I was being as polite and hoping you could figure it out. Your comment was shitting on newer practitioners because they have easier access to information than you did. I call bullshit on that attitude.
You also seem very invested in this “old school/old timer” practitioner identity, while somehow leaving out the humility to allow newer practitioners to be where they are. Strange.
Having access to every occult book ever written, every secret, every advanced text, means absolutely nothing unless someone actually practices. On that point, I suspect we probably agree.
So why the attitude toward people having better access to information? You could just lead by example.
Time in the occult does not automatically equal depth, wisdom, competence, or authority. It means you have spent time in/around the occult. What you did with that time is the part that matters.
Verbosity and elegant prose do not equal knowledge. Complexity does not equal depth. And making newer practitioners feel lesser because they didn't have to struggle for information the way you did is gatekeeping.
This must obviously be a sensitive topic for you, though you must assuredly be confused in your assertion. I appreciate that the nuanced concept was lost while you stumbled upon this over-simplified and highly assumptive perspective, imagining you understood the point made, which clearly was not the case. have you tried re-reading the comment a few times and possibly considering it a bit more deeply before jumping to conclusions?
We can all be a bit hastey when our emotions get in the way and we see what we want to, so dont feel bad, though the comment you just made doesnt actually add to this conversation in any meaningful way as its not actually responding to or at all accurately characterising what I said, while maintainting the air of pretence do do so.
But thanks for tryingyou get a bronse star for attendance
This must obviously be a sensitive topic for you, though you must assuredly be confused in your assertion. I appreciate that the nuanced concept was lost while you stumbled upon this over-simplified and highly assumptive perspective, imagining you understood the point made, which clearly was not the case. have you tried re-reading the comment a few times and possibly considering it a bit more deeply before jumping to conclusions?
We can all be a bit hastey when our emotions get in the way and we see what we want to, so dont feel bad, though the comment you just made doesnt actually add to this conversation in any meaningful way as its not actually responding to or at all accurately characterising what I said, while maintainting the air of pretence do do so.
But thanks for tryingyou get a bronse star for attendance
What did I mischaracterize exactly about your post?
Not another paragraph about me personally. Not the bronze star. Not the Gen Alpha swing and a miss attempts.
Specifically: how did I read you incorrectly when you said the newer generation has access to too much information too easily, and then followed it with: “Now the youngsters just jump through advanced content and do the practice and it seems slapdash.” That part.
Please explain how I misread those words and how that is not gatekeeping. If you meant something different from what you actually wrote, explain it. If I genuinely misunderstood you, I’ll apologize and let it rest.
Until then, you’re up to bat.
Speaking directly to the topic here, even if a new practitioner has access to advanced material and is actually able to put it to use effectively, I say great for them. We should want other practitioners to experience the magic, develop skill, make contact with spirit, and progress regardless of whether their path looked like ours.
One principle I do think is broadly useful in occult work is resistance to dogma. What works for you personally is great for you. That has very little bearing on what another practitioner must believe or how they must practice.
Even the best occult material is still guidance. It is not universal law. The more experience we gain, the more obvious it becomes that we usually know far less than we thought we did.
Eventually most serious practitioners begin modifying things anyway. We create our own rituals, our own formats, our own spellcraft, and our own ways of working based on experience.
This must obviously be a sensitive topic for you, though you must assuredly be confused in your assertion. I appreciate that the nuanced concept was lost while you stumbled upon this over-simplified and highly assumptive perspective, imagining you understood the point made, which clearly was not the case. have you tried re-reading the comment a few times and possibly considering it a bit more deeply before jumping to conclusions?
We can all be a bit hastey when our emotions get in the way and we see what we want to, so dont feel bad, though the comment you just made doesnt actually add to this conversation in any meaningful way as its not actually responding to or at all accurately characterising what I said, while maintainting the air of pretence do do so.
But thanks for tryingyou get a bronse star for attendance
"Your comment was shitting on newer practitioners because they have easier access to information than you did"
There for a start..
I was pointing out that when things come too easilt people dont appreciate them and make proper use of them. And too much isnt always better, as it makes for lack of application of basic principles before advancing.
Has nothing to do with dogma. And this comment: "And making newer practitioners feel lesser because they didn't have to struggle for information the way you did is gatekeeping" is just ridiculous really. Nobody actually did that at all. When my Sensei's told me to train basic technique more and not waste time on the jhumping uramawashi giri, I listened and paid off.. Because I focused on less. The newer practitioners can benefit from this advfice, so your attempt at twisting the facts serves no purpose. as for: "Verbosity and elegant prose do not equal knowledge. Complexity does not equal depth" We agree on this atleast and simplicity is the king. Though again, you are off clutching at straws to make your strawman argument.. I was bridging Hemetics, Dao, Vedic lore and being mindful of physics, hence words needed to be carefully chosen as inflection matters. The concepts shared are however very simple and thats something you seemed to miss. What you also failed to realise, is how readily people can misconstrue words and end up with a ridiculous word salad as you started with. Alot of words that essentially say nothing. Alot of words that say alot, thats another story.
As for : "Eventually most serious practitioners begin modifying things anyway. We create our own rituals, our own formats, our own spellcraft, and our own ways of working based on experience." - the irony isnt lost on me :-D Though I agree with the sentiment, it seems clear that some hypocracy is lurkingt in the depths and spluttering along behind that statement. As the articl;e was an organic expression of unconventional thought, the very unconventional practice you here praise, so the idrony isnt lost on your inference here made.
There's some sincere feedback.
Big Love
"Your comment was shitting on newer practitioners because they have easier access to information than you did"
There for a start..
I was pointing out that when things come too easilt people dont appreciate them and make proper use of them. And too much isnt always better, as it makes for lack of application of basic principles before advancing.
Has nothing to do with dogma. And this comment: "And making newer practitioners feel lesser because they didn't have to struggle for information the way you did is gatekeeping" is just ridiculous really. Nobody actually did that at all. When my Sensei's told me to train basic technique more and not waste time on the jhumping uramawashi giri, I listened and paid off.. Because I focused on less. The newer practitioners can benefit from this advfice, so your attempt at twisting the facts serves no purpose. as for: "Verbosity and elegant prose do not equal knowledge. Complexity does not equal depth" We agree on this atleast and simplicity is the king. Though again, you are off clutching at straws to make your strawman argument.. I was bridging Hemetics, Dao, Vedic lore and being mindful of physics, hence words needed to be carefully chosen as inflection matters. The concepts shared are however very simple and thats something you seemed to miss. What you also failed to realise, is how readily people can misconstrue words and end up with a ridiculous word salad as you started with. Alot of words that essentially say nothing. Alot of words that say alot, thats another story.
As for : "Eventually most serious practitioners begin modifying things anyway. We create our own rituals, our own formats, our own spellcraft, and our own ways of working based on experience." - the irony isnt lost on me :-D Though I agree with the sentiment, it seems clear that some hypocracy is lurkingt in the depths and spluttering along behind that statement. As the articl;e was an organic expression of unconventional thought, the very unconventional practice you here praise, so the idrony isnt lost on your inference here made.
There's some sincere feedback.
Big Love
I appreciate the clarity in your response. Some of your points I agree with.
My original reading of the words you used wasn’t pulled out of thin air. Your clarification helps, but it doesn’t erase the original wording or tone. I prefer your clarification over the original.
You drifted a bit at the end, though. There’s no hypocrisy lurking anywhere. If I take issue with something, I’ll tell you. I’m not here for validation, mincing words, or word salad. I say what I mean, and I’m generally pretty straight to the point.
I also don’t take anything personally on this forum, maybe its a GenX thing. We can fight, get nasty, disagree, or whatever else, then leave it in the thread where it belongs. Easy day.
you get a bronse star for attendance