Too many spells at once?

[opiumpoetry]

So I want to hex a really evil person. I did one spell 5 times in 5 days. I did another spell on the second day. And I'm doing the jar of water in the freezer thing (it's still in there).

My question is, will doing all these spells at once have a cumulative effect, like shooting a dozen arrows at once to make sure you hit the target, or will all these spells at once interfere with each other and water each other down?

Your feedback will be much appreciated. Thanks!

 

[Xenophon]

I've heard three schools of thought. The one crowd does a working every day till results are obtained or patience exhausted. Others insist you shoot once, like in a duel. Personally, I pick a number of days that resonates in the tradition I practice. (What that is, is not relevant to the matter at hand.) Depending on the tradition, you could be talking 3, 7, 9, 10, 11, 13 days here. I know one school that insists that 40 days is best.

Bottom line: look to your tradition to see what's been found to work.

 

[pixel_fortune]

So I want to hex a really evil person. I did one spell 5 times in 5 days. I did another spell on the second day. And I'm doing the jar of water in the freezer thing (it's still in there).

My question is, will doing all these spells at once have a cumulative effect, like shooting a dozen arrows at once to make sure you hit the target, or will all these spells at once interfere with each other and water each other down?

Your feedback will be much appreciated. Thanks!

This is very much a chaos magic perspective, but to me the issue is that doing multiple spells for the same thing expresses a lack of faith in the first spell, which then undermines it

It's related to the idea of "lust for result". You want to walk away from a spell dusting off your hands and going "glad I got THAT sorted", completely confident that it's being handled.

Someone completely confident that it's being handled wouldn't cast the spell 4 more times.

However, this is okay if each spell comes at the problem from a different angle. Like if I want a boyfriend and I cast "get me a boyfriend" 5 times, that's charging the situation with insecure and desperate energy. But if I cast "increase my chances of running into handsome strangers" and "make me extra charming" and "make other attractive women spontaneously decide to go to a different event tonight" ....or whatever. Different angles of improving my odds. Then that would be solid.

Other people would disagree (they think your attitude doesn't play a role in the success of a spell) but this is my view on it

Post automatically merged: Feb 21, 2024

The vibe is very different though if you decide in advance "I'm doing a single working that involves repeating a ritual 5 times" (as opposed to "I just cast this spell... I'm gonna do it again to be on the safe side")

 

[HoldAll]

So I want to hex a really evil person. I did one spell 5 times in 5 days. I did another spell on the second day. And I'm doing the jar of water in the freezer thing (it's still in there).

My question is, will doing all these spells at once have a cumulative effect, like shooting a dozen arrows at once to make sure you hit the target, or will all these spells at once interfere with each other and water each other down?

Your feedback will be much appreciated. Thanks!

I'd say it depends on your attitude. Some authors say that multiple spells are a sign that you don't have confidence in your magic and that repeating a ritual is proof of self-doubt. On the other hand, if the spells are meant to be a part of a planned escalation, so to speak, one being more malevolent than the other, you might get your cumulative effect. However, if you decide the next day that the original spell probably didn't work and cast it again and again, you are basically highlighting your helplessness.

In my very limited experience, I found that repeating a ritual over and over can be beneficial in order to comfortable with it (I think of the first few attempts as 'dress rehearsals') but I don't think this approach is suitable for such a spell where one charges an object with strong emotions. Like I said, it depends on your attitude. To repeat a spell out of insecurity may not work but if it's design as a five-part operation, why not?

 

[opiumpoetry]

I've heard three schools of thought. The one crowd does a working every day till results are obtained or patience exhausted. Others insist you shoot once, like in a duel. Personally, I pick a number of days that resonates in the tradition I practice. (What that is, is not relevant to the matter at hand.) Depending on the tradition, you could be talking 3, 7, 9, 10, 11, 13 days here. I know one school that insists that 40 days is best.

Bottom line: look to your tradition to see what's been found to work.

What if my tradition is "I have no tradition--I came across this spell on a website and it's the 1st spell I've ever done"?

Post automatically merged: Feb 21, 2024

This is very much a chaos magic perspective, but to me the issue is that doing multiple spells for the same thing expresses a lack of faith in the first spell, which then undermines it

It's related to the idea of "lust for result". You want to walk away from a spell dusting off your hands and going "glad I got THAT sorted", completely confident that it's being handled.

Someone completely confident that it's being handled wouldn't cast the spell 4 more times.

However, this is okay if each spell comes at the problem from a different angle. Like if I want a boyfriend and I cast "get me a boyfriend" 5 times, that's charging the situation with insecure and desperate energy. But if I cast "increase my chances of running into handsome strangers" and "make me extra charming" and "make other attractive women spontaneously decide to go to a different event tonight" ....or whatever. Different angles of improving my odds. Then that would be solid.

Other people would disagree (they think your attitude doesn't play a role in the success of a spell) but this is my view on it

Post automatically merged: Feb 21, 2024

The vibe is very different though if you decide in advance "I'm doing a single working that involves repeating a ritual 5 times" (as opposed to "I just cast this spell... I'm gonna do it again to be on the safe side")

Thing is, after I did the 1st time, I felt elated and maybe euphoric the rest of the day. Not really the next 4 days. I've read feeling elated after a spell means it's definitely working. If I didn't feel anything the next 4 days, is that a sign I undermined my spell by repeating 4 more times?

Post automatically merged: Feb 21, 2024

This is very much a chaos magic perspective, but to me the issue is that doing multiple spells for the same thing expresses a lack of faith in the first spell, which then undermines it

It's related to the idea of "lust for result". You want to walk away from a spell dusting off your hands and going "glad I got THAT sorted", completely confident that it's being handled.

Someone completely confident that it's being handled wouldn't cast the spell 4 more times.

However, this is okay if each spell comes at the problem from a different angle. Like if I want a boyfriend and I cast "get me a boyfriend" 5 times, that's charging the situation with insecure and desperate energy. But if I cast "increase my chances of running into handsome strangers" and "make me extra charming" and "make other attractive women spontaneously decide to go to a different event tonight" ....or whatever. Different angles of improving my odds. Then that would be solid.

Other people would disagree (they think your attitude doesn't play a role in the success of a spell) but this is my view on it

Post automatically merged: Feb 21, 2024

The vibe is very different though if you decide in advance "I'm doing a single working that involves repeating a ritual 5 times" (as opposed to "I just cast this spell... I'm gonna do it again to be on the safe side")

Thing is, after I did the 1st time, I felt elated and maybe euphoric the rest of the day. Not really the next 4 days. I've read feeling elated after a spell means it's definitely working. If I didn't feel anything the next 4 days, is that a sign I undermined my spell by repeating 4 more times?

 

[Wintruz]

Do it once, do it well. If you do it right, once will be enough. You have to bring your energy to a fever pitch and then totally release it into an appropriate symbol. Then, let go. Put it out of your mind and move on. Don't look for signs, don't even think about it.

All the endless energy you're presently pouring into it through this marathon of activity is actually counter-productive.

 

[HoldAll]

I'd say you felt elated the first time because you took action, it doesn't necessarily mean the spell was sucessfully. Discussing the whole operation here already may be detrimental, viz. the "To keep silent" rule (just the pessimistic tone of my comment alone may cause harmful interferences - see?).

 

[Xenophon]

What if my tradition is "I have no tradition--I came across this spell on a website and it's the 1st spell I've ever done"?

Post automatically merged: Feb 21, 2024

Thing is, after I did the 1st time, I felt elated and maybe euphoric the rest of the day. Not really the next 4 days. I've read feeling elated after a spell means it's definitely working. If I didn't feel anything the next 4 days, is that a sign I undermined my spell by repeating 4 more times?

Post automatically merged: Feb 21, 2024

Thing is, after I did the 1st time, I felt elated and maybe euphoric the rest of the day. Not really the next 4 days. I've read feeling elated after a spell means it's definitely working. If I didn't feel anything the next 4 days, is that a sign I undermined my spell by repeating 4 more times?

I'd say spend some time learning the basics before casting spells. That means some prolonged exposure to a tradition/school/ style of magick. Otherwise you're not Leon the Professional, you're Sirhan Sirhan, Wilkes Booth, Squeaky Fromme, John Hinkley: a p*****-off tyro whose success is mostly happenstance and who's left exposed.

 

[pixel_fortune]

I have

I'd say spend some time learning the basics before casting spells. That means some prolonged exposure to a tradition/school/ style of magick. Otherwise you're not Leon the Professional, you're Sirhan Sirhan, Wilkes Booth, Squeaky Fromme, John Hinkley: a p*****-off tyro whose success is mostly happenstance and who's left exposed.

Ehhh I don't agree with this

I think sometimes the best way to learn is just give it a go, and then when you study you have more context for what you're reading

(Esp when you consider how many people are like "I've been studying the LBRP for three years and I'm going to give it a go just as soon as I have every single possible circumstance perfect for it")

So long as theory and practice keep roughly apace, I don't think think the exact order of operations matters too much

Post automatically merged: Feb 22, 2024

it's the 1st spell I've ever done

Thing is, after I did the 1st time, I felt elated and maybe euphoric the rest of the day. Not really the next 4 days.

Why did you decide to do it four more times, if you felt like it went well the first time?

Was it out of anger at the person you're cursing? Or more about wanting to repeat the elation you felt on the first day?

(I'm just thinking: if it's the latter, maybe you just enjoy doing magic? and if you enjoy it, then of course you want to do it again, but maybe you should try a spell for improving some other area of your life, rather than spamming the same spell over and over

If it's the first one, I would say pivot to magic aimed at relaxing your own brain's fixation on this person (I'm taking your word for it that this person sucks, and given they suck, there's not much value in thinking about them, when you could be thinking about something that doesn't suck)

 

[Vandheer]

Ehhh I don't agree with this

I can see his point though.

Because more than likely the person will just butcher up the ritual, they are unable to concentrate, cant move energy well, the spell is nothing more than a silly moment looking from 3rd person perspective.

 

[pixel_fortune]

I can see his point though.

Because more than likely the person will just butcher up the ritual, they are unable to concentrate, cant move energy well, the spell is nothing more than a silly moment looking from 3rd person perspective.

Sure but that's true of learning any new skill

Fear of making a mistake and of looking silly is the exact fear that keeps people in the armchair for years. (And again, stops people from learning non-magical new skills too)

The solution to "I'm afraid of making a mistake and looking silly" isn't "study so much theory that you perform your first ritual perfectly", it's "Accept that you probably will make mistakes. Accept that you will probably look silly. Know that your ego is strong enough to survive the embarrassment."

Doing your first ritual is facing the above fear. So someone who faces that fear early on, has done something of real value for their magical career, regardless of the outcome of the spell itself

Post automatically merged: Feb 22, 2024

Also I studied a tonne but I still felt really self-conscious and ridiculous in my first ritual, and definitely made lots of mistakes. So I think the awkward first ritual is just the price of entry to magic. Might as well pay it upfront.

 

[Vandheer]

The solution to "I'm afraid of making a mistake and looking silly" isn't "study so much theory that you perform your first ritual perfectly", it's "Accept that you probably will make mistakes. Accept that you will probably look silly. Know that your ego is strong enough to survive the embarrassment."

You are diverting from the point here. I am calling them silly, not saying they think themselves to be, but most of us likely thought it silly at first, sure.

Fear of making a mistake and of looking silly is the exact fear that keeps people in the armchair for years. (And again, stops people from learning non-magical new skills too)

Look you are nitpicking some words and running with it here. Neither Xenophons or my point is 'you will look silly', 'you will make a mistake'. Thats not it. It is "it would be useful if you could have some training so you understand what you are doing". That doesn't take goddamn years to achieve. Reading one book would be enough. Surely not a spell site, for a hex out of everything.

The Chaos Magick you praised, look into Liber Null and practically the first thing Carroll wants you to do is to reach 30 mins of concentration. Even the founder of Chaos Magick seems to think some training would be good.

Stop turning my point into some anti-thesis of coming out of magick closet.

 

[pixel_fortune]

? Okay?

We both agree you should do both study and practice. The only point of difference is you think it has to be "A then B", and I think "A then B" and "B then A" are both fine, much of a muchness.

You pointed out the potential problem with my approach, I pointed out the potential problem with your approach. Since I think both approaches are basically fine, the potential problem I see in yours is not super likely, but that's the one I see.

You're reacting intensely for what's a pretty minor difference of opinion

 

[Vandheer]

You're reacting intensely for what's a pretty minor difference of opinion

 

[Xenophon]

I have

Ehhh I don't agree with this

I think sometimes the best way to learn is just give it a go, and then when you study you have more context for what you're reading

(Esp when you consider how many people are like "I've been studying the LBRP for three years and I'm going to give it a go just as soon as I have every single possible circumstance perfect for it")

So long as theory and practice keep roughly apace, I don't think think the exact order of operations matters too much

Post automatically merged: Feb 22, 2024

Why did you decide to do it four more times, if you felt like it went well the first time?

Was it out of anger at the person you're cursing? Or more about wanting to repeat the elation you felt on the first day?

(I'm just thinking: if it's the latter, maybe you just enjoy doing magic? and if you enjoy it, then of course you want to do it again, but maybe you should try a spell for improving some other area of your life, rather than spamming the same spell over and over

If it's the first one, I would say pivot to magic aimed at relaxing your own brain's fixation on this person (I'm taking your word for it that this person sucks, and given they suck, there's not much value in thinking about them, when you could be thinking about something that doesn't suck)

"Buying a gun does not make one armed any more than does buying a piano make one a musician."---Col. Jeff Cooper.

If one is starting what could turn out to be a magickal fight, it very much behooves him to master a few basic skills, offensive and defensive. If OP has a genuine grievance to redress, waiting some months should sharpen focus, not defuse all righteous rage.

 

[opiumpoetry]

I have

Ehhh I don't agree with this

I think sometimes the best way to learn is just give it a go, and then when you study you have more context for what you're reading

(Esp when you consider how many people are like "I've been studying the LBRP for three years and I'm going to give it a go just as soon as I have every single possible circumstance perfect for it")

So long as theory and practice keep roughly apace, I don't think think the exact order of operations matters too much

Post automatically merged: Feb 22, 2024

Why did you decide to do it four more times, if you felt like it went well the first time?

Was it out of anger at the person you're cursing? Or more about wanting to repeat the elation you felt on the first day?

(I'm just thinking: if it's the latter, maybe you just enjoy doing magic? and if you enjoy it, then of course you want to do it again, but maybe you should try a spell for improving some other area of your life, rather than spamming the same spell over and over

If it's the first one, I would say pivot to magic aimed at relaxing your own brain's fixation on this person (I'm taking your word for it that this person sucks, and given they suck, there's not much value in thinking about them, when you could be thinking about something that doesn't suck)

"Why did you decide to do it four more times, if you felt like it went well the first time?"
I just assumed that doing a spell again and again is like showering the enemy with with lots of arrows just to make sure the job gets done. I didn't know at the time that most people say you should do a ritual just once. Now I know.

Post automatically merged: Feb 25, 2024

Do it once, do it well. If you do it right, once will be enough. You have to bring your energy to a fever pitch and then totally release it into an appropriate symbol. Then, let go. Put it out of your mind and move on. Don't look for signs, don't even think about it.

All the endless energy you're presently pouring into it through this marathon of activity is actually counter-productive.

"You have to bring your energy to a fever pitch and then totally release it into an appropriate symbol."
How do I do that? Should I be angry and enraged during the ritual or silently strong?

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

My opinion is make minor tweaks to make each try different.
For example, using godform A, godform B, godfrom C, godform D, godform E. Or calling on Saint A, Saint B, Saint C, Saint D, Saint E; calling on Godname A, Godname B, Godname, C, Godname D, Godname E.
Or do it five consecutive days to the same deity, for example Andras or Hecate.
Or, do it five consecutive days, invoking the planet of the day via the Lesser Invoking Ritual of the Hexagram. For example, Mon Luna, Tue Mars, Wed Mercury, Thurs Jupiter, Fri Venus. Or invoke maleific planets, alternating, such as Mars, Luna, Saturn.

 

[HoldAll]

"You have to bring your energy to a fever pitch and then totally release it into an appropriate symbol."
How do I do that? Should I be angry and enraged during the ritual or silently strong?

That's the hardest thing in such an operation, first to work oneself up and then let go. The emotion has to be 100% genuine (righteous anger, blind fury or whatever) - it's no use to play pretend. The idea is to charge objects, to give them meaning and to imbue them with authentic feelings so they cease to be mundane objects and become living symbols of your desire. It takes a lot of concentration to do that (that's why most authors recommend meditation) but maybe you are a natural and able to channel these emotions at will. At least that's the theory behind it, I myself am still stuck at the meditation and practising stage.

 

[Robert Ramsay]

That's the hardest thing in such an operation, first to work oneself up and then let go. The emotion has to be 100% genuine (righteous anger, blind fury or whatever) - it's no use to play pretend. The idea is to charge objects, to give them meaning and to imbue them with authentic feelings so they cease to be mundane objects and become living symbols of your desire. It takes a lot of concentration to do that (that's why most authors recommend meditation) but maybe you are a natural and able to channel these emotions at will. At least that's the theory behind it, I myself am still stuck at the meditation and practising stage.

As I understand it, you can either overload or 'underload' your emotions.

The 'underloading' comes from meditation and allows you to program yourself in the medatitive state of complete detachment and then let it pass as you would any other thought whilst meditating.

The overloading is easier. What Grant Morrison refers to as 'the wank method' although frenzied dancing and drumming (as in the stereotypical voodoo ritual) also works. The trick is (as you say) to summon up this tsunami of emotion whilst still being able to hold onto the sigil or whatever without allowing it to get in the way, otherwise you may find your desire replaced by 'I hope this works'

I've also summoned up excitement (feels like the prospect of an exciting holiday or something like that) when I've been around people and they haven't even noticed. The technique is something like tensing muscles in my back, but it's difficult to explain it more than that, although I personally would recommend focussing on heightening positive emotions. Human beings being what they are, it seems easier to get rid of them afterwards

 

[theantichrist]

The water doesn't magnetize for too long, it's bettee using oil. In any case I wonder how good is having that in your fridge