What is the point of using demons if you can use angels instead?

[MerlinLeGrande]

I just wanted to know what the advantage would be?

 

[embitca]

Why not use both, depending on what it is you want? It doesn't need to be either/or.

 

[David Wilson-Steer]

This question came up in my magic group. Actually, several people wanted to know the best angel to ask for money. The answer is none of them. John Dee asked the angels for more money and they just ignored him. One of my group members asked his angel several times for money only to be told "Don't worry about it." In the Abramelin book there are magic squares for various workings and each one lists whether angels, demons or both will perform the task. Anything to do with the Earth Plane is performed by demons. Angels and gods can't touch stuff. They can't move things around. You need demons or elementals for that.

 

[myneckneverhurts]

I just wanted to know what the advantage would be?

ime most people only use demons because they want to seem edgy. of course there are much better reasons, but it appears to me that's the main one for the majority of demon conjurers.

 

[Morell]

This question sounds to me like question: Why to use your left hand when you can use your right hand?

 

[Anomander Rake]

Both are entities you can contact and use. So, why not?

But some people's path is different than each other. Some path requires working with angels, some path requires wkrking with demons.

 

[beardedeldridge]

Loaded question with an over generalized response but: good rule of thumb is a demon with fix the symptom immediately but an angel will more permanently fix the underlying cause thru a more drawn out process.

A difference in time horizon and motivation/interest. Just depends what you’re looking for or maybe how pressing is the issue.

But it’s sorta like comparing people from country A and country B. Sure you can draw some stereotypes that will prove accurate often enough but there is always nuances and exceptions.

-Eld

 

[agloval]

I agree with David Wilson-Steer, each has its own qualities, you don't ask the shoemaker to make you a coat, maybe he could pull it off, but that's not his job. Stealing his analogy here. Also, angels can screw you over just as much as demons, maybe even worse.

 

[David Wilson-Steer]

I agree with David Wilson-Steer, each has its own qualities, you don't ask the shoemaker to make you a coat, maybe he could pull it off, but that's not his job. Stealing his analogy here. Also, angels can screw you over just as much as demons, maybe even worse.

Ah, you've been there too ...

 

[agloval]

Ah, you've been there too ...

Sadly yes hahaha

 

[fungus77]

The way I think of it might be kinda silly but...

You: Can I have a cookie?
Angel: No, they're not good for you and you'll spoil your dinner.

You: Can I have a cookie?
Demon: Sure.
You: -eats a ton of cookies and gets a stomachache.... unless you had the self control and the sense to eat a single cookie-

 

[CCCT]

Why use either? Unless you’ve yet to forge some close relationships with spirits that fit in neither category.
Both factions strike me as overcomplicated and overdogmatic in their own ways. That said, a lot of the beings classified as “demons” were just spirits that were provably existent but didn’t really fit the mold for angels when they were writing the book.
I dunno, I always feel like the gentleman with the thistle down hair when I say this but, why not just ask the north wind or the dawn?
you don’t have to use either demons or angels, go make friends with one of the unnamed spirits that lives in your garden and get them to help.
They’re easy to talk to and quite helpful if treated appropriately.

 

[nunaphael]

After having read books like Agrippa's Three Books on Occult Philosophy I got it in my head that demons are not evil, they are just servitors that carry out the divine order on a lower level than angels do. The reason you'd work with demons is because they are the workers that actually come out to your location and build the house you want built. Angels are coordinators, officials, messengers, admins. They dont do lesser labors. They judge things, issue commands, communications, decrees, demands, orders, questions, inquisitions, etc. Demons were meant to serve us, they are like intangible intelligences which are slightly above a monkey but below a human being. If you treat them with respect the way you treat a family dog or a prize horse with respect but not exactly like your equal, just something you treat with dignity, then you have the right attitude toward working with demons in my opinion. They only cause problems when you dont treat them with dignity, same as any living thing.

 

[akenu]

When I used to work with Enochian spirits (angels based on Dee), I had a feeling that they were actually annoyed with me, sort of like I didn't do what I was supposed to do based on the "Great plan" and instead I was bothering them.

 

[Firetree]

An angel will not cause you to get banned

 

[Hada Yasmin]

This question came up in my magic group. Actually, several people wanted to know the best angel to ask for money. The answer is none of them. John Dee asked the angels for more money and they just ignored him. One of my group members asked his angel several times for money only to be told "Don't worry about it." In the Abramelin book there are magic squares for various workings and each one lists whether angels, demons or both will perform the task. Anything to do with the Earth Plane is performed by demons. Angels and gods can't touch stuff. They can't move things around. You need demons or elementals for that.

This is very informative and easy to understand.

 

[OberonFromTheHills]

The way I think of it might be kinda silly but...

You: Can I have a cookie?
Angel: No, they're not good for you and you'll spoil your dinner.

You: Can I have a cookie?
Demon: Sure.
You: -eats a ton of cookies and gets a stomachache.... unless you had the self control and the sense to eat a single cookie-

Ex goetians who come back to Jesus after years of abuse :

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[wizard003439]

The way I think of it might be kinda silly but...

You: Can I have a cookie?
Angel: No, they're not good for you and you'll spoil your dinner.

You: Can I have a cookie?
Demon: Sure.
You: -eats a ton of cookies and gets a stomachache.... unless you had the self control and the sense to eat a single cookie-

To add: and you learn from eating too much: you grow wiser. This comes natural.

But otherwise, indeed, that would be on your own volition and it is something a lot of people deny themselves, even when they cry out in woe, "what have I done unto myself" I myself will cry from thankfulness having learnt.

And also from having eaten infinite cookies. Gah daim. mmmmmm

Anyway, the distinguishment is ...faith. Can you trust something external enough to forfeit yourself/your domains/your authorship/growing yourself/whatever?

I myself take authorship. I am not here to be in awe and wonder of it all. I make my own awe and wonder from it all; I manifest instead of suckling the unknown.

End of rant

 

[Lord Talve]

Nice information

 

[wizard003439]

This question came up in my magic group. Actually, several people wanted to know the best angel to ask for money. The answer is none of them. John Dee asked the angels for more money and they just ignored him. One of my group members asked his angel several times for money only to be told "Don't worry about it." In the Abramelin book there are magic squares for various workings and each one lists whether angels, demons or both will perform the task. Anything to do with the Earth Plane is performed by demons. Angels and gods can't touch stuff. They can't move things around. You need demons or elementals for that.

You don't actually implement the words and shapes you make up into the conscious/awareness of the target of your communications, you share/project the words and shapes their underlying intent. Also when you communicate/project onto "other entities" or their symbols.

The intent for people that wish money generally are, less stress, more grip, more being able to manifest/be themselves or just live their life or sleep better/at all. This is what angels (try to) take care of in a generalized way, anyway so best case you get ignored ("well duh, can't you read my shirt?" - Random Angel 2026) or worst case make them weep because you have a lowered frequency, and are yearning/mourning/clamoring for relief.

Or something, anyway end of rant