Why does the Goetic spirit not manifest itself physically?

[David Wilson-Steer]

When I try to evoke a spirit of the Goetia he manifests himself mentally, I ask for signs and they are answered, but why when I order him to manifest physically he doesn't obey my order?

The physical appearance of a spirit is not what the spirit looks like. This might be a bit hard to get your head around, I know it was for me, but the Sigil (Seal) is the actual spirit and the appearance of the spirit is only a symbol of it. Tricky huh? That's why you ask the spirit to identify itself which it does by showing its sigil (showing itself actually). Which is why no other spirit can show you some other spirit's sigil. It's a bit like me pretending I'm you and someone asks to see your driver's license to prove it.

Having said that, there is a Tibetan method of bringing the spirit to physical manifestation but it involves creating a sand mandala and then meditating beside it for a very long time - months maybe even years.

The other thing to consider is that EVERYTHING is an Illusion. Maybe meditate on that.

 

[Frater Kael]

Ce que Frater a dit était : « C'est étrange, quand je vous ai lu, j'ai eu presque peur. Je n'ai jamais compris que pour parler avec un esprit, il fallait utiliser un appareil de divination. Quand j'invoque un esprit, il apparaît physiquement. Croyez-le ou non, cela a toujours été le cas. C'est pourquoi lorsque je lis un livre sur la divination ou le channelling pour transmettre un soi-disant message d'un esprit, cela me dérange. »

Je dois tout cela à Mme Beauté, ma prof de français de première année. Elle m'a dit : « Utilise le traducteur automatique, toi, horrible crétin ! Et ne t'approche pas de moi. » En fait, j'ai utilisé Bing Translate.

Sérieusement, quand tu dis « physiquement », tu veux dire comme une forme visible ou comme une entité solide ? Quel genre d'invocation utilises-tu ?

When I say physical, I mean physical. The entity can take on any physical form, it's the evocator (me) who will ask it to take on a human form. You can't do this kind of thing in a closed space, the manifestation won't be the same. These aren't things you're going to find in books. I don't ask people to believe or not to believe. People who know about this know exactly what I'm talking about. There are so many crazy things in this world.

 

[Xenophon]

When I say physical, I mean physical. The entity can take on any physical form, it's the evocator (me) who will ask it to take on a human form. You can't do this kind of thing in a closed space, the manifestation won't be the same. These aren't things you're going to find in books. I don't ask people to believe or not to believe. People who know about this know exactly what I'm talking about. There are so many crazy things in this world.

Interesting point there. Steve Savedow writes a lot of the difficulties he had getting visible manifestations. I notice his insistence on indoor space. He even deplores the fact he did not have a secluded house set apart. Likewise I recall Kevin Grant having had some troubles with spirits indoors. Recall as well Anton Long's insistence that evocations be conducted out doors in secluded country.

 

[Xag9]

Interesting point there. Steve Savedow writes a lot of the difficulties he had getting visible manifestations. I notice his insistence on indoor space. He even deplores the fact he did not have a secluded house set apart. Likewise I recall Kevin Grant having had some troubles with spirits indoors. Recall as well Anton Long's insistence that evocations be conducted out doors in secluded country.

Yes environment matters and how you specifically feel inside that environment matters. The Evocator must feel a sense of security and a "no care in the world" feeling, overall you must feel "closed" or "locked in" I personally aslo had a hard time doing magical things outside my temple. This problem doesn't hold much weight of significance in my experience and it's just a reflection of one's personality - I am an introvert for example and I do have a hard time mixing the crowd even energetically.

Thus being said, its not impossible to physically manifest or scry a spirit to existence because my experience proved me that you can evoke a demon in a church. I had evoked my demonic familiar in physical manifestation in an orthodox church during the Easter Liturgy, i could literally see the face of the spirit in my physical vision for a few seconds. it was harder than usual and i was almost like fighting to keep my attention and energy pointed towards a place that i had no disturbance (Keeping a silent mind and personal energy that was not interfering with anything or anyone) the inner battle was that of constant refocus and re adjusting.

 

[Accipeveldare]

When I try to evoke a spirit of the Goetia he manifests himself mentally, I ask for signs and they are answered, but why when I order him to manifest physically he doesn't obey my order?

It doesn't obey your order mostly because daemons don't usually appear physically, however you are also treating them like tools and they feel very disrespected by this fact. You see, the ars goetia was written by a man who used the power of YHWH to control daemons and make them abide his will, however, the fact is that they are likely on listening to you due to their own interests and not yours. They don't actually have to abide your word and won't if they choose not to.

Post automatically merged: Oct 8, 2024

My advice, treat daemons with respect and perhaps they will treat you with it too and you'll get more out of it in the process. Hiding behind a salt circle and using the power of YHWH will only do so much. Anger them too if you get on their bad side

Post automatically merged: Oct 8, 2024

And from my experience, nobody ever comes out the same when they anger a daemon

 

[David Wilson-Steer]

When they do manifest physically they don't look like they do in the Goetia. It's like when you ask for something, it usually doesn't manifest the way you might be expecting. When I do see spirits they often appear physically as children. I also understand that they see me as a child of similar age too. When you achieve the knowledge & conversation of your HGA you see them physically quite often. But then, I've programmed myself to perceive them. I didn't expect to see them the way they do though. An interesting example is Dee & Kelly's scrying where the first spirit Kelly sees is Madimi who appears as a young girl and then, over eight years she grows up and in the last description of her she's a young woman.