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Resources for the proper pronunciation of Barbarous Names of the PGM

Nerone

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If any practitioners of the PGM could throw me a bone here, it would be tremendously appreciated - Koine Greek seems to be the way to go, but it's a huge field of study given that's it's also the language of the New Testament and Septuagint.

For practical purposes I'm mostly interested in the pronunciation, but I find myself overwhelmed in choosing a starting point
 

glaive

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I have found Practical Occult really helpful for this! They have some posts that show the IPA for names in various excerpts, like in this
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.

Also, Wikipedia has a section for
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so whenever I get around to learning Greek I will probably start with Koine and then use the Egyptian vowel pronunciation for PGM specific names.
 

HoldAll

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There are several threads about the correct pronounciation of barbarous names, look for 'pronunciation' in the heading (arrgh… I have mild OCD when it comes to spelling mistakes in thread titles, your own won't yield any results). Here's a pronounciation guide for the vowels of Attic Greek:

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It's a matter of conjecture whether the PGM authors used Greek script to describe sounds that were originally based on their own native Demotic or on their local variety of Koiné Greek. Scholars will even disagree on the proper pronounciation of Latin, for example 'c' as in 'caesar' – is it 'k', 'ts', or 'tch'? Jason Miller's solution was having a Greek native speaker pronounce an
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, a valid approach as any.

When in doubt, many authors recommend a 'Germanised' pronounciation for barbarous names or Qabalistic angels – take a look at Damon Brand's "The 72 Angels of Magick" and his pronounciation guide on p. 30, many other authors use the same system.


Many people would say it's the vowels that really count, and there's even a book called "The Mystery of the Seven Vowels In Theory and Practice" by Joscelyn Godwin in the Library. My personal theory is that the vowels correspond to the chakras, so that 'u' ('ooh' or however you'd like to express it in English) would be the root chakra and a high-pitched 'i' ('eeh') the crown chakra. My advice is to try a couple of version and see which one feels most powerful or resonates best with you.

English spelling itself is very inconsistent – why are 'though' and 'trough', or 'butcher' and 'but', pronounced so differently?
 

Nerone

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That's really helpful, thank you guys.

By the way @HoldAll I believe it's spelled "pronunciation" and not "pronounciation". As in the word "enunciate". Anyhow. My own research so far has led me to this;

First, there is actually a place in the PGM that gives instructions for the pronunciation of the vowel sounds:

the “A” with an open mouth, undulating like a wave; [A, α]
the “O” succinctly, as a breathed threat. [O, ο]
the “IAÔ” to earth, to air, and to heaven. [ΙAΩ, ιαω]
the “Ê” like a baboon; [Η, η]
the “O” in the same way as above; [O, ο]
the “E” with enjoyment, aspirating it, [Ε, ε]
the “Y” like a shepherd, drawing out the pronunciation. [Υ, υ]

PGM V. 24 – 30


Second, there is an excellent
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by Dr. Sasha Chaitow behind a subscription wall that makes a compelling argument for utilizing Modern Greek. As she says;

If we explore the actual language as it has been spoken, sung, and evolved since late antiquity, we might come far closer to something resembling the “original” pronunciation and use of such incantations, hidden in plain sight.

A key point to bear in mind is that we are not debating the pronunciation of Classical Attic Greek (the version arbitrarily applied by some scholars to represent all of Greek speech in antiquity, largely regardless of region and period), but of Hellenistic Koine in Egypt and Asia Minor: two forms of pronunciation as disparate as those of (modern) Glasgow vs. New York, to provide but one analogy.

While there is clear historical evidence for the prosodic nature of Attic Greek, it is as bizarre to propose the Erasmian reconstruction of this particular variant as the only authentic pronunciation across Greek-speaking regions and periods, as it is to propose that all historical English should henceforth be spoken in a reconstructed version of Chaucerian or
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English (prior to the
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)

Which I think is a very fair point. I don't think the efficaciousness of a given language lies in any exact Orthodox pronunciation, given the huge variety of dialects in any language and whatnot - but I do think there is merit in approaching a language and get close to it's native "feel" and "rhythm".

Third, I found this rather funny
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of the difference in pronunciation of the ancient philosophers which is really helpful to me. I have always pronounced the first part of "Pythagoras" in the same way one would pronounce the word "Python", or "Plato" as in "Play Dough", which is of course incorrect, and this is what I'm trying to avoid in magical usage.

Fourth, I found this really awesome
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of how the pronunciation of Greek has developed throughout the different eras. This
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which made the abovementioned spreadsheet also seems solid, at least judging by some of the commenters who, as native speakers, are glad to hear him pronounce the Greek properly.

And fifth, I see that
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has some pronunciation guides of certain PGM spells up on his channel, which does sound Greek and not Anglicized attempts at Greek, but whether that is correct or not I cannot say.

I'll see where it goes.
 

frater_pan

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English spelling itself is very inconsistent – why are 'though' and 'trough', or 'butcher' and 'but', pronounced so differently?
Because once upon a time an island that kept getting invaded and had a form of early English which was certainly cognate with some version of Saxon from what is now northern Germany/Denmark + Celtic languages. They were invaded by the Romans which changed the English a bit. Then they were continuously invaded by Vikings that resulted in changes to English. After 100 or so years the Vikings forgot they had invaded. This happened several times. Then in 1066 Viking descendants who thought they were French invaded the island and unalterably changed English.
 
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