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I have been having paranormal experiences where the demon takes control of me and wants me to have sex. It acts as though I am the one having sex and criticizes or ridicules "me," often things that are sort of obviously off, like a person trying to be hateful.
Is this normal? And is sex magick usually "just demon possessed sex" so to speak?
I think they are loving and kind beings who will always look out for their lovers. I see others calling them parasitic or evil but this is far from the truth. If you've been in a relationship with a loving succubus or incubus you will know they are not parasitic nor evil. They should not be...
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Additionally, I wonder whether demons will so readily and demurely conform to our human idea what sex is, for example regarding the number of appendages and orifices involved as well as the question which goes where, or if they have any concept of such niceties like consent or safewords at all.
I think they are loving and kind beings who will always look out for their lovers. I see others calling them parasitic or evil but this is far from the truth. If you've been in a relationship with a loving succubus or incubus you will know they are not parasitic nor evil. They should not be...
wizardforums.com
Post automatically merged:
Additionally, I wonder whether demons will so readily and demurely conform to our human idea what sex is, for example regarding the number of appendages and orifices involved as well as the question which goes where, or if they have any concept of such niceties like consent or safewords at all.
I have been having paranormal experiences where the demon takes control of me and wants me to have sex. It acts as though I am the one having sex and criticizes or ridicules "me," often things that are sort of obviously off, like a person trying to be hateful.
Is this normal? And is sex magick usually "just demon possessed sex" so to speak?
I think they are loving and kind beings who will always look out for their lovers. I see others calling them parasitic or evil but this is far from the truth. If you've been in a relationship with a loving succubus or incubus you will know they are not parasitic nor evil. They should not be...
wizardforums.com
Post automatically merged:
Additionally, I wonder whether demons will so readily and demurely conform to our human idea what sex is, for example regarding the number of appendages and orifices involved as well as the question which goes where, or if they have any concept of such niceties like consent or safewords at all.
I don't know if I believe that. At least some ridicule and criticism seems to go into all / most / many major versions of tantric practice. For example, I was reading about demon work, where am advanced guru will attach a spirit that needs to develop sexually or resolve some sexuality issues (or that domain metaphysically), in a way that also advances you. That experience is often not pleasant. I forget what it is called. Shaivites and Tibetan buddhists both do something similar, as far as I know higher level western sex magick does all the similar kinds of things (masonry allegedly, the OTO, etc)
I don't know if I believe that. At least some ridicule and criticism seems to go into all / most / many major versions of tantric practice. For example, I was reading about demon work, where am advanced guru will attach a spirit that needs to develop sexually or resolve some sexuality issues (or that domain metaphysically), in a way that also advances you. That experience is often not pleasant. I forget what it is called. Shaivites and Tibetan buddhists both do something similar, as far as I know higher level western sex magick does all the similar kinds of things (masonry allegedly, the OTO, etc)
The aim of Tantra is religious, not mundane. If you have any unresolved sexual issues, your guru won't select this method for you.
The yidams (meditational deities) of Tibetan Buddhist Tantra are enlightened beings who can be either peaceful or wrathful. According to legend, wrathful deities are in fact former demons whom Padmasambhava tamed and made protectors of Buddhism in Tibet. Their iconography is drastically gruesome but you can tell they're enlightened if they're depicted with a third eye. They're reformed demons, if such a thing is possible.
Tantra is an advanced spiritual practice, not psychotherapy. The main goal of deity yoga is to meld with a god or goddess - however, how that union is achieved is secondary. In India, Tantra has a strong antinomian flavour where scandalising pious Hindus is deliberately embraced, e.g. where Brahmins would eat meat, drink liquor, and have sex with lower-caste women as part of rituals, both for shock value and for purposes of deconditioning, thereby demonstrating that nothing is impure and everything is sacred as per Tantric doctrine. In monastic Tibetan Buddhism, however, the Tantric stage comes after years and years of slowly progressing along the Sutric path of conventional Buddhism, supposedly making it an accelerated path to enlightenment.
In Tibetan Buddhism, Tantra constitues a bold alternative approach to spirituality, a bit like "Enlightenment or bust!" Nothing is said to be taboo in Tantra but at the same time, sexual rites, real or imagined, would be tantamount to breaking one's monastic vowns. Monks will spend years and years to rise above their earthly craving, and suddenly they're supposed to use them as a propellant for spiritual awakening which will take a certain maturity. The danger here is that young monks would develop a hankering for debauchery, give up monastic life altogether and thus accumulate tons of bad karma. The question whether actual sexual rites occur in monasteries is still hotly debated. Some lamas insist that unions with gods and goddesses only ever take place symbolically, others insist they're part of the program, e.g. the Kalachakra Tantra - some texts are quite explicit in this respect and leave nothing to the imagination. But like I said, sex itself is only a means to an end here and not meant to be therapeutic.
I linked to the notorious succubi brouhaha thread because it shows what can go wrong, and the power gradient will probably not be in your favour.
I don't know if I believe that. At least some ridicule and criticism seems to go into all / most / many major versions of tantric practice. For example, I was reading about demon work, where am advanced guru will attach a spirit that needs to develop sexually or resolve some sexuality issues (or that domain metaphysically), in a way that also advances you. That experience is often not pleasant. I forget what it is called. Shaivites and Tibetan buddhists both do something similar, as far as I know higher level western sex magick does all the similar kinds of things (masonry allegedly, the OTO, etc)
You better believe it ! If you going to mess around with 'demons' . Its the classic turn into psychosis / possesion .
I dont know why you went off from this into 'ridicule in major versions of tantra ' , I was talking about you claiming the demon ridicules criticizes and takes control of you . This is a danger sign . Its a danger sign beyond what you might think of it personally as it is attested by many patients that are 'in care ' for 'psychiatric' reasons VERY similar to ' possession ' .
YOu were 'reading about advanced gurus' that attack a spirit to you ? Source ? validity ? BS ? be careful what you read and give validity to . You say it , in a way advances you . Do these 'gurus' attack a spirit that controls criticises and abuses you as part of your advancement ?
And now you claim high level masonry and OTO do this stuff ??? Where are you getting these ideas ?
Respect is one of the four main principles in this work ... if you didnt know , and it goes BOTH ways
'' Therefore fear not the Spirits, but be firm and courteous with them; for thou hast no right to despise or revile them; and this too may lead thee astray. Command and banish them, curse them by the Great Names if need be; but neither mock nor revile them, for so assuredly wilt thou be lead into error.''
'' Lower order voices are as though one is dealing with drunken bums at a bar who like to tease and torment just for the fun of it. They will suggest lewd acts and then scold the patient for considering them. They find a weak point of conscience and work on it interminably. For instance one man heard voices teasing him for three years over a ten-cent debt he had already paid. They call the patient every conceivable name, suggest every lewd act, steal memories or ideas right out of consciousness, threaten death, and work on the patient's credibility in every way. For instance they will brag that they will produce some disaster on the morrow and then claim honor for one in the daily paper. They suggest foolish acts (such as: Raise your right hand in the air and stay that way) and tease if he does it and threaten him if he doesn't. The lower order can work for a long time to possess some part of the patient's body. Several worked on the ear and the patient seemed to grow deafer. One voice worked two years to capture a patient's eye which visibly went out of alignment. Many patients have heard loud and clear voices plotting their death for weeks on end, an apparently nerve-wracking experience. One patient saw a noose around his neck which tied to "I don't know what" while voices plotted his death by hanging. They threaten pain and can cause felt pain as a way of enforcing their power. The most devastating experience of all is to be shouted at constantly by dozens of voices. When this occurred the patient had to be sedated. The vocabulary and range of ideas of the lower order is limited, but they have a persistent will to destroy. They invade every nook and cranny of privacy, work on every weakness and credibility, claim awesome powers, lie, make promises and then undermine the patient's will. They never have a personal identity though they accept most names or identities given them. They either conceal or have no awareness of personal memories. Though they claim to be separate identities they will reveal no detail that might help to trace them as separate individuals. Their voice quality can change or shift, leaving the patient quite confused as to who might be speaking. When identified as some friend known to the patient they can assume this voice quality perfectly. For convenience many patients call them by nick-names, such as "Fred," The Doctor," or "The Old Timer." I've heard it said by the higher order that the purpose of the lower order is to illuminate all of the person's weaknesses. They do that admirably and with infinite patience. To make matters worse they hold out promises to patients and even give helpful sounding advice only to catch the patient in some weakness. Even with the patient's help I found the lower order difficult to relate to because of their disdain for me as well as the patient. ''
THIS is what you should seek ;
''
n direct contrast stands the rarer higher order hallucinations. In quantity they make up perhaps a fifth or less of the patients' experiences. The contrast may be illustrated by the experience of one man. He had heard the lower order arguing a long while how they would murder him. He also had a light come to him at night like the sun. He knew it was a different order because the light respected his freedom and would withdraw if it frightened him. In contrast, the lower order worked against his will and would attack if it could see fear in him. This rarer higher order seldom speaks, whereas the lower order can talk endlessly. The higher order is much more likely to be symbolic, religious, supportive, genuinely instructive, and communicate directly with the inner feelings of the patient. I've learned to help the patient approach the higher order because of its great power to broaden the individual's values. When the man was encouraged to approach his friendly sun he entered a world of powerful numinous experiences, in some ways more frightening than the murderers who plotted his death. In one scene he found himself at the bottom of a long corridor with doors at the end behind which raged the powers of hell. He was about to let out these powers when a very powerful and impressive Christ-like figure appeared and by direct mind-to-mind communication counseled him to leave the doors closed and follow him into other experiences which were therapeutic to him. In another instance the higher order appeared to a man as a lovely woman who entertained him while showing him thousands of symbols. Though the patient was a high-school educated gas-pipe fitter, his female vision showed a knowledge of religion and myth far beyond the patient's comprehension. At the end of a very rich dialogue with her (the patient reporting her symbols and responses) the patient asked for just a clue as to what she and I were talking about. Another example is that of a Negro who gave up being useful and lived as a drunken thief. In his weeks of hallucinations the higher order carefully instructed him on the trials of all minority groups and left him with the feeling he would like to do something for minorities.
In general the higher order is richer than the patient's normal experience, respectful of his freedom, helpful, instructive, supportive, highly symbolic and religious. It looks most like Carl Jung's archetypes, whereas the lower order looks like Freud's id. In contrast to the lower order, it thinks in something like universal ideas in ways that are richer and more complex than the patient's own mode of thought. It can be very powerful emotionally and carry with it an almost inexpressible ring of truth. The higher order tends to enlarge a patient's values, something like a very wise and considerate instructor. Some patients experience both the higher and lower orders at various times and feel caught between a private heaven and hell. Many only know the attacks of the lower order. ''
- I suggest it might be more helpful to you to research valid sources ; like the above and not what some lame youtuber thinks ... or you might find yourself deep in magical or psychological poop .
Post automatically merged:
edit time out ; above 'attack' should be 'attach ' .
You better believe it ! If you going to mess around with 'demons' . Its the classic turn into psychosis / possesion .
I dont know why you went off from this into 'ridicule in major versions of tantra ' , I was talking about you claiming the demon ridicules criticizes and takes control of you . This is a danger sign . Its a danger sign beyond what you might think of it personally as it is attested by many patients that are 'in care ' for 'psychiatric' reasons VERY similar to ' possession ' .
YOu were 'reading about advanced gurus' that attack a spirit to you ? Source ? validity ? BS ? be careful what you read and give validity to . You say it , in a way advances you . Do these 'gurus' attack a spirit that controls criticises and abuses you as part of your advancement ?
And now you claim high level masonry and OTO do this stuff ??? Where are you getting these ideas ?
Respect is one of the four main principles in this work ... if you didnt know , and it goes BOTH ways
'' Therefore fear not the Spirits, but be firm and courteous with them; for thou hast no right to despise or revile them; and this too may lead thee astray. Command and banish them, curse them by the Great Names if need be; but neither mock nor revile them, for so assuredly wilt thou be lead into error.''
'' Lower order voices are as though one is dealing with drunken bums at a bar who like to tease and torment just for the fun of it. They will suggest lewd acts and then scold the patient for considering them. They find a weak point of conscience and work on it interminably. For instance one man heard voices teasing him for three years over a ten-cent debt he had already paid. They call the patient every conceivable name, suggest every lewd act, steal memories or ideas right out of consciousness, threaten death, and work on the patient's credibility in every way. For instance they will brag that they will produce some disaster on the morrow and then claim honor for one in the daily paper. They suggest foolish acts (such as: Raise your right hand in the air and stay that way) and tease if he does it and threaten him if he doesn't. The lower order can work for a long time to possess some part of the patient's body. Several worked on the ear and the patient seemed to grow deafer. One voice worked two years to capture a patient's eye which visibly went out of alignment. Many patients have heard loud and clear voices plotting their death for weeks on end, an apparently nerve-wracking experience. One patient saw a noose around his neck which tied to "I don't know what" while voices plotted his death by hanging. They threaten pain and can cause felt pain as a way of enforcing their power. The most devastating experience of all is to be shouted at constantly by dozens of voices. When this occurred the patient had to be sedated. The vocabulary and range of ideas of the lower order is limited, but they have a persistent will to destroy. They invade every nook and cranny of privacy, work on every weakness and credibility, claim awesome powers, lie, make promises and then undermine the patient's will. They never have a personal identity though they accept most names or identities given them. They either conceal or have no awareness of personal memories. Though they claim to be separate identities they will reveal no detail that might help to trace them as separate individuals. Their voice quality can change or shift, leaving the patient quite confused as to who might be speaking. When identified as some friend known to the patient they can assume this voice quality perfectly. For convenience many patients call them by nick-names, such as "Fred," The Doctor," or "The Old Timer." I've heard it said by the higher order that the purpose of the lower order is to illuminate all of the person's weaknesses. They do that admirably and with infinite patience. To make matters worse they hold out promises to patients and even give helpful sounding advice only to catch the patient in some weakness. Even with the patient's help I found the lower order difficult to relate to because of their disdain for me as well as the patient. ''
THIS is what you should seek ;
''
n direct contrast stands the rarer higher order hallucinations. In quantity they make up perhaps a fifth or less of the patients' experiences. The contrast may be illustrated by the experience of one man. He had heard the lower order arguing a long while how they would murder him. He also had a light come to him at night like the sun. He knew it was a different order because the light respected his freedom and would withdraw if it frightened him. In contrast, the lower order worked against his will and would attack if it could see fear in him. This rarer higher order seldom speaks, whereas the lower order can talk endlessly. The higher order is much more likely to be symbolic, religious, supportive, genuinely instructive, and communicate directly with the inner feelings of the patient. I've learned to help the patient approach the higher order because of its great power to broaden the individual's values. When the man was encouraged to approach his friendly sun he entered a world of powerful numinous experiences, in some ways more frightening than the murderers who plotted his death. In one scene he found himself at the bottom of a long corridor with doors at the end behind which raged the powers of hell. He was about to let out these powers when a very powerful and impressive Christ-like figure appeared and by direct mind-to-mind communication counseled him to leave the doors closed and follow him into other experiences which were therapeutic to him. In another instance the higher order appeared to a man as a lovely woman who entertained him while showing him thousands of symbols. Though the patient was a high-school educated gas-pipe fitter, his female vision showed a knowledge of religion and myth far beyond the patient's comprehension. At the end of a very rich dialogue with her (the patient reporting her symbols and responses) the patient asked for just a clue as to what she and I were talking about. Another example is that of a Negro who gave up being useful and lived as a drunken thief. In his weeks of hallucinations the higher order carefully instructed him on the trials of all minority groups and left him with the feeling he would like to do something for minorities.
In general the higher order is richer than the patient's normal experience, respectful of his freedom, helpful, instructive, supportive, highly symbolic and religious. It looks most like Carl Jung's archetypes, whereas the lower order looks like Freud's id. In contrast to the lower order, it thinks in something like universal ideas in ways that are richer and more complex than the patient's own mode of thought. It can be very powerful emotionally and carry with it an almost inexpressible ring of truth. The higher order tends to enlarge a patient's values, something like a very wise and considerate instructor. Some patients experience both the higher and lower orders at various times and feel caught between a private heaven and hell. Many only know the attacks of the lower order. ''
- I suggest it might be more helpful to you to research valid sources ; like the above and not what some lame youtuber thinks ... or you might find yourself deep in magical or psychological poop .
Post automatically merged:
edit time out ; above 'attack' should be 'attach ' .
Yes, very much like the lower order spirits. The higher order spirits are at this point significantly less than five percent, but used to be much closer to even higher than five percent of my experiences.
I don't have the capacity to get the sources but I will when I can, regarding "demon work" where gurus will attach the spirit, etc.
In my case, it is not obvious that a guru is doing this, I was just pointing out that the situations can be ambiguous. In my case the experiences caused by at least one of the entities are clearly not for my overall benefit, so there was no question here.
Thanks for the quote, very helpful when I find someone articulating what I am experiencing and usually unable to articulate (because of the very same spirits causing the issue).
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