[Opinion] Doing work in the astral vs imaginative visualization

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

Hi all,

I'd like to start doing my practical work in the astral 50% of the time, due to practical work consideration for the upcoming grades, and due to privacy and will concerns.

So how do I know that I am out of body?
These rituals will have to take place oob.

How do you return safely?

Does memory and consciousness maintain a clear record the entire time for journaling and gnosis purposes?

Thanks in advance.

Post automatically merged: Jun 1, 2023

I'd like to view the process, light and effects from a detached perspective.

Post automatically merged: Jun 2, 2023

Example, sitting in the east facing west, I visualize myself stepping out of my body and standing, turning clockwise to face the east, doing the east adoration, doing the LIRP, turning clockwise to west, doing adoration, and closing with middle Pillar, turning clockwise and being seated again.
But the question is .. was it really done astrally or just visualized?

 

[Roma]

was it really done astrally or just visualized?

Your lightbody can be managed separately from your physical body

 

[Understanding]

Hi all,

I'd like to start doing my practical work in the astral 50% of the time, due to practical work consideration for the upcoming grades, and due to privacy and will concerns.

So how do I know that I am out of body?
These rituals will have to take place oob.

How do you return safely?

Does memory and consciousness maintain a clear record the entire time for journaling and gnosis purposes?

Thanks in advance.

Post automatically merged: Jun 1, 2023

I'd like to view the process, light and effects from a detached perspective.

Post automatically merged: Jun 2, 2023

Example, sitting in the east facing west, I visualize myself stepping out of my body and standing, turning clockwise to face the east, doing the east adoration, doing the LIRP, turning clockwise to west, doing adoration, and closing with middle Pillar, turning clockwise and being seated again.
But the question is .. was it really done astrally or just visualized?

I am also unsure about this. For there is also a seperation in meanings here. In between astral projection and esp. One of them is in a deep state of imagination. And the other is exactly like reality. I might be wrong. But that is how I understand it. I have had deep imagination, like lucid dreaming. It is very vivid, I thought that was reality, but it wasn’t exactly as real like reality. As the laws of physics was not set in stone. It was more chaotic. However I have had tactile sensations in meditation. That someone was sticking me in the face, or teeth. Felt like a dentist poking around. And it was surreal, because I opened my eyes and the sensation was still there. Back and forth. At my top front teeth and nose. And that scared me, so I managed to shake it off and stood up. But as I laid down again, I felt it even more even though I hadn’t started meditating. So I stopped. And I have not had a proper meditation after that. Since it scared me that I might accidentally fuck up my own perception of reality. So I think we can change the entire way we percieve reality, even with our senses.

 

[Konsciencia]

Hi all,

I'd like to start doing my practical work in the astral 50% of the time, due to practical work consideration for the upcoming grades, and due to privacy and will concerns.

So how do I know that I am out of body?
These rituals will have to take place oob.

How do you return safely?

Does memory and consciousness maintain a clear record the entire time for journaling and gnosis purposes?

Thanks in advance.

Post automatically merged: Jun 1, 2023

I'd like to view the process, light and effects from a detached perspective.

Post automatically merged: Jun 2, 2023

Example, sitting in the east facing west, I visualize myself stepping out of my body and standing, turning clockwise to face the east, doing the east adoration, doing the LIRP, turning clockwise to west, doing adoration, and closing with middle Pillar, turning clockwise and being seated again.
But the question is .. was it really done astrally or just visualized?

That is one of my goals, is to develop magickal Powers. You can do it.

In one of my experiences, I was in this Dark place and the Clouds were green. The whole point, of it was, that around me, surrounding me. Were this Artificial Intelligence and I happen to have full control and felt the AI's It was fun.

 

[heavysm]

Keep in mind that you might need to be grounded while you do your astral work, because not fully returning back to your body leads to lack of life focus, and possibly mind and life instability, because your focus and mind thinking is grounded in your astral body safely and fully turning back, to the physical body, so that you can work through that.

Imaginative visualization can be useful, and fun as well - but just be aware that doing deep, or explorative astral work and traveling can be productive work, but that you also need that be safely and successfully done as well, without any problems arising that might cause you, life or mental disruption as well.

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

Reviving this thread, because of the pathworkings I'm attempting.
I see darkness with eyes closed, but straining closed eyes see flashes of color.
At times non stressed, on control of my space, not depressed, I can visualize a grass green pentagram or a light blue pentagram, a red and blue hexagram for example.
So, imaginative visualization or astral work, if I cannot retain control of visualization, how well would I fare in the astral?

 

[Konsciencia]

Reviving this thread, because of the pathworkings I'm attempting.
I see darkness with eyes closed, but straining closed eyes see flashes of color.
At times non stressed, on control of my space, not depressed, I can visualize a grass green pentagram or a light blue pentagram, a red and blue hexagram for example.
So, imaginative visualization or astral work, if I cannot retain control of visualization, how well would I fare in the astral?

It takes a hell of a lot of practice. Since you've helped me with the Dark Night of the Soul thing. I can help you with Visualizing stuff. Let me know if you want to.

 

[Roma]

how do I know that I am out of body?

Mental activity is often out of the brain and therefore out of the body. That is common in meditation and dreams

When your visualization surprises you, that often indicates that you are seeing something external to yourself.

Whether what you see is real, is a harder question and requires some ability to stand outside of Existence in order to test the observation.

The presence of the Five Electricities in the scene seems to be sufficient proof of the scene being natural/real

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

 

[Konsciencia]

Mental activity is often out of the brain and therefore out of the body. That is common in meditation and dreams

When your visualization surprises you, that often indicates that you are seeing something external to yourself.

Whether what you see is real, is a harder question and requires some ability to stand outside of Existence in order to test the observation.

The presence of the Five Electricities in the scene seems to be sufficient proof of the scene being natural/real

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Let me ask you a question Roma, when one Visualizes him/Herself Out of the Body does that means you are Out of your Body too? I think about that from time to time.

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

@Roma and @Konsciencia Yeah, that was my concern since the path of Gimel (on the Kitcher tree) is the vision of the camel crossing the abyss. And I can use help visualizing out of darkness to the light.

 

[Roma]

when one Visualizes him/Herself Out of the Body does that means you are Out of your Body too

It usually means that part of the mental body is projected away from the physical body.

The etheric and astral bodies will usually still be anchored to the dense physical body

I often get people to project out of their light-body and do experiments on that.

For example project out of your light-body and look at it. Then visualize some test substance/words/entity next to it and see what happens

Try pushing your light-body out of the solar system, galaxy, universe, cluster of universes, cluster of clusters...

How far do you get before your light-body meets resistance to your pushing?


So what is it that steps outside the light-body and can push it around?

Is that the real you?

 

[Xenophon]

It takes a hell of a lot of practice. Since you've helped me with the Dark Night of the Soul thing. I can help you with Visualizing stuff. Let me know if you want to.

When it comes to "visualizing," I can't do much aside from occasional periods of purple light lasting some whiles back behind my eyelids. But a state something much like awake-dreaming comes pretty readily, with visual surroundings and aural/dream communication. These include other actors that seem to operate by their own volition. Would you call this visualization or just strong day-dreaming?

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

Funny you mention daydreaming. In my younger years I used to daydream a lot.
These years not so much.

 

[Konsciencia]

When it comes to "visualizing," I can't do much aside from occasional periods of purple light lasting some whiles back behind my eyelids. But a state something much like awake-dreaming comes pretty readily, with visual surroundings and aural/dream communication. These include other actors that seem to operate by their own volition. Would you call this visualization or just strong day-dreaming?

I would have to say, visualization.

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

One thing that can be helpful is knowing Greek and or Hebrew esoteric meanings, and projecting or visualizing them and noting thoughts or images that arise.
Same with Tarot majors, if you can visualize them in your mind from memory of the card it tends to help with visualization.

 

[Konsciencia]

It usually means that part of the mental body is projected away from the physical body.

The etheric and astral bodies will usually still be anchored to the dense physical body

I often get people to project out of their light-body and do experiments on that.

For example project out of your light-body and look at it. Then visualize some test substance/words/entity next to it and see what happens

Try pushing your light-body out of the solar system, galaxy, universe, cluster of universes, cluster of clusters...

How far do you get before your light-body meets resistance to your pushing?


So what is it that steps outside the light-body and can push it around?

Is that the real you?

Sounds interesting! Thank you Roma. This will help me a lot.

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

Can anyone explain the reason why there is a color flashed by use of a God-Name vibrated, but disappears within three seconds? In a pathworking of Gimel (Kether to Tiphareth) using Ehieh then Gimeliah, then YHVH Eloah ve Daath, i saw unmistakable imagery of the spheres and the path. But if it (visualization of colors or images) responds, why does it disappear so quickly?

 

[Roma]

Energies have impacts on the human light-body. The impacts can be detected visually and therefore with colors.

Smells are also important when testing energies.

Intent concealed within the energy is perhaps the most important

If the energy does not last long, then going back on the time line will allow longer examination

 

[Xenophon]

One thing that can be helpful is knowing Greek and or Hebrew esoteric meanings, and projecting or visualizing them and noting thoughts or images that arise.
Same with Tarot majors, if you can visualize them in your mind from memory of the card it tends to help with visualization.

I think Peter Savedow has an exercise of working through the whole Tarot deck as a series of visualizations spread out over a few months (to, I gather, a year or more.) I tried it about a year back. It is interesting, to say the least, especially the relations between one card and another as the exercise proceeds.

One can also do something similar with the runes, laying out a circle over a broad, broad swathe of landscape. (I used a fjord in southeast Alaska.)

 

[Diluculo_DelFuego]

Yeah, Paul Foster Case in Tarot Fundamentals has weekly exercises for each Major card/key.
Will check out Savedow though.. thanks!

Post automatically merged: Nov 16, 2023

It still seems my visualization is impaired, or obscured.