Opinions on using drops of your blood as offerings?

[Ziran]

Just for the sake of comparison, would offering other people's blood be considered equally devotional or less or more?

Less.

Less "skin in the game"

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[Xenophon]

Just for the sake of comparison, would offering other people's blood be considered equally devotional or less or more?

Not THAT'S a question. One could divide it up into whether the blood was voluntarily given, stolen, and what all have you. I imagine you'd get swildly differeing answers from, say, Kenneth Grant, O9A, Crowley, and others.

A good many historical cultures made shedding a foes blood a rite of passage. The Plains Indians (some tribes) held that "counting coup"---striking an enemy without killing him---was the biggest test of courage. So I could imagine a sorceror saying something similar. That blood taken against the wishes of a powerful foe was more powerful than simply cutting one's own finger. Of course, stealing a more powerful mage's blood is no easily done thing, even setting the legalities aside.

 

[Djnenas]

Actually, the right neighborhood in a city can inure one to the sight of blood. Like Bogie tells the Wehrmacht officers in "Casablanca," "There are certain neighborhoods in New York I'd advise even you to stay out of."

Absolutely!!! I live there and there isn't one day i don't dream of the possibility of LEAVING never to go back again!! Living in the most marginal areas (anywhere really) where crime runs amock, will desensitize one to blood squeamishness. Even just driving by those areas could do it. There has been so much blood spilled on every corner for no good reason. It definitely does something to your psyche. But what about diabetics that have to prick their fingers all throughout the day to check their sugar??? Do these "sensitives" consider them satanics????

 

[Xenophon]

Absolutely!!! I live there and there isn't one day i don't dream of the possibility of LEAVING never to go back again!! Living in the most marginal areas (anywhere really) where crime runs amock, will desensitize one to blood squeamishness. Even just driving by those areas could do it. There has been so much blood spilled on every corner for no good reason. It definitely does something to your psyche. But what about diabetics that have to prick their fingers all throughout the day to check their sugar??? Do these "sensitives" consider them satanics????

Well...the disbetics are scrying human blood for information not available to laymen. Plus they use implements whose mechanics only a few cognoscienti understand. Sounds suspicious to me. Imagine how it'll play out in the First Babtist Church in Toadstomp, Texas' piney woods.

 

[Fausto]

I Would only use my blood with Angels, archangels, Ancestral witches or orishas.
That's It.

 

[beardedeldridge]

Why has magic gotten so performative? Is it required for that type of working? Does it make the magic more/less effective? There’s your answer. Don’t involve anyone else.

Quick rabbit trail (I apologize in advance):
Magic has been done certain ways for thousands of years (and yes improvements can be made to anything) but these days we want to take the blood, the animals, the reverse tarot cards, the hard work, dedication, the discipline, the personal sacrifice, etc…….. out of it then we sit around and wonder why we don’t get results from our spells/why our readings don’t provide any real insight/why nothing shows up when we evoke. Then we take the lack of anything happening and think that it’s proof that these minor/no results are all that’s achievable through magic.

Personally:
But yes I’ve used my blood as a form of payment or pact making to great effect in certain instances. I’ve also introduced my blood to a ritual where I shouldn’t have and fell on my face (metaphorically) because or it.

-Eld

 

[stalkinghyena]

Less "skin in the game"

So, devotion as transactional/contractual, obviously with the corresponding emotions of the symbology of blood as vehicle of energetic transmission. I guess that makes sense.
But what if the target end of devotion, as part of the contract, next demands the blood of others as a continuance of vassalage? Would then the value of other's blood take greater importance?

One could divide it up into whether the blood was voluntarily given, stolen, and what all have you.

It gets me weighing which is the greater sacrifice - what one is willing to give with a pin prick or what one is not willing to give. Of course this can extend to a lot of scenarios, and I assuming that greater giving means greater reception in terms of power. I have Al-Kindi's "stellar rays" model in mind.

Why has magic gotten so performative?

When was it not?

 

[Ziran]

Would then the value of other's blood take greater importance?

Definitely.

If I am charged with a task, and I am changing or negligent of the details, that would be a problem.

However, if any of these divine beings start giving ME orders, that's an even bigger problem. They work for me. Not the other way around. And this ignores the obvious concerns regarding hearing voices, etc...

 

[WonderFire]

IMHO blood gives too much of a link to yourself, so I don't think I'd give it to most beings. Maybe the ones that are already linked to me in some way, if you have some kind of a guardian spirit of some kind. Considering your hair, nail clippings or even a footprint in the mud(!) are thought to be more than enough of a link to cast devastating curse on you, blood should be even more potent link.

Also, consider that in every relationship what you do becomes normal and doing less is seen as negative. If I tell you to do a job for me and I'll pay you 500$, you'll expect the same amount of money for a job of that magnitude in the future. Suddenly 300$ feels like you're being cheated. OTOH if you were started off with 300$ and I offered 50 bucks bonus next time you'd feel even better than if you got 500$ money first time.
When offering trend exploded I started seeing people try to bribe spirits with offerings like crazy but as far as I've seen they got hit with diminished returns super hard. Altars filled with offerings and publicly praising spirits because they managed to scrounge up rent money this month.
Now extrapolate this to giving blood.

Expectation management is everything when dealing with people (with, or without a body).

 

[beardedeldridge]

When was it not?

lol point goes to stalkinghyena

 

[Pyrokar]

wanted to drop this but i confused the two op's

Book – PDF - The Occult Significance Of Blood - Rudolf Steiner (1906)

Here is another naked booklet, so you know its good, for all my wanna be Lestats out there I don't know enough about Rudolf Steiner to comment, but i will so anyway - i don't like his face. But i do like this lecture, i was agreeing with most of what was said. most of it is hermetical. This will...

wizardforums.com

 

[Aeternus]

Blood in both pacts and various blood magic practice holds a lot of significance. It is a very potent fluid which has almost both ethereal and physical connections with the practicioner.

Blood is very strong in magic! However, despite the "eternal" nature of pacts, they are not eternal! Some pacts have limited amounts of time before expiring, just like a non-esoteric contract, and some don't even require blood for signing the pact.

In case of Demons, Lucifer may not ask you for blood, but for a more broader sense of "part belonging to you". He may ask you to do something in his favor, for example, or he will tell you to renounce some dear memories of yours in order to sign the deal.

Some may require specific objects, besides blood to be stipulated in a deal, such as an object that is dear to the summoner.

I consider blood to be more as establishing a connection to whatever entity you wish to pact with, but, from proper experience I tell, it is best to be careful who you pact with by blood.

Once you do it, it will be very hard to remove it almost nigh-impossible. Not totally impossible though.

Usually, people need to get away from the paradigm of "you signed pact with Lucifer, it is for eternity". Pacts are not eternal. Some last months, years, but certainly not eternity.

The worse some can do is bind themselves to multiple Demons, as seen in the Urban Grainder's "bogus" pact with several Demons, or Christoph Haizmann's pact written deal with the Devil in 1669.

 

[Not_there]

The first time that I offered my blood I did it because of the symbolism, tbh

The offering of my blood was my was of showing how much I trusted the entity and how much I wanted to stabilish a contact with him because I was asking for his protection.

It worked, btw. And I knew that that my offering was accepted because later I dreamed that I was drinking from the entity's blood so I interpreted that as "take my blood as I took yours" type of deal, to signify reciprocity.

Blood offerings (as far as I know) can serve as:

Source of vital energy given to entity you're calling/working with.
A devotional act to show trust and in some cases gratitude.
A symbolic act to represent you're desire for connection and reciprocity.

But be careful, if you're going to offer your blood I recommend doing some divination to see the posible outcome of that action because it can be negative, what if the entity sees blood as impure and insulting? For example the demon King Paimon (as far as I know) has a repulsion to blood offeings, and the same goes for the Olympian Gods they HATE blood offerings because its disgusting and contaminating for them.

 

[Morell]

I find it kind of funny when people are so afraid or disgusted by blood, yet they eat meat, some every day.

Blood is very powerful in magic, something I enjoy working with. However Blood is sort of part of you and is kind of part of your private space, very intimate. So I think that's how it should be managed in magic. To use it only for things, spirits, deities, that you are willing to let so close to you.
Reminds me of the Idea of Odinn sacrificing himself to himself. I think that using your own blood is very close to that concept.

 

[Xenophon]

I find it kind of funny when people are so afraid or disgusted by blood, yet they eat meat, some every day.

Blood is very powerful in magic, something I enjoy working with. However Blood is sort of part of you and is kind of part of your private space, very intimate. So I think that's how it should be managed in magic. To use it only for things, spirits, deities, that you are willing to let so close to you.
Reminds me of the Idea of Odinn sacrificing himself to himself. I think that using your own blood is very close to that concept.

That's different. Meat is from grocery stores. No animals are harmed in making my burgers. Yours is a good point, though. We might not shut our eyes exactly, but a lot of folks squint a lot.

I think I read somewhere where some mage said, "Never offer blood to any entity you would not share all secrets with." Like your man---er, Asir---Odin said, "Safest are secrets known to none." (Runesong)

 

[Khoren_]

Just saw and read through this thread... Since most everyone is saying the same thing, I figured I'd just summarize.

Sacrifice is key to most offering.s A blood sacrifice from thine own flesh (and blood) is showing that you are willing to put your own "skin in the game" as one poster mentioned prior. This is why for centuries (millennia?) we sacrificed animals, most often the fattest, richest, most healthy animal. To show we are willing to sacrifice what we specifically hold dear. In a blood sacrifice, we are offering the dearest thing of all: ourselves.

But the idea is also: do not sacrifice that which you are willing to lose. You do not pay for an item with the option of not receiving the item, thus so for spells. If you are unsure the spell "requires" blood as payment, why pay for it in such? As one poster put, you wouldn't (shouldn't?) pay for an ask in blood to an entity that you aren't comfortable sharing your life with (literally). Am I going to summon Tzeentch begging for money and offering blood? Probably not.

Personally, I'm of the squeamish sort, and blood, to me, isn't necessarily a "bad" offering, but I don't deal with those who request blood offerings anyways. Ganesh always asks for candy, and Aerys typically is okay with trading info, or just general chaos. Equivalent exchange goes both ways. Don't offer blood if blood isn't needed, and don't give blood if blood isn't needed (sounds like I said the same thing twice...)

 

[Morell]

That's different. Meat is from grocery stores. No animals are harmed in making my burgers. Yours is a good point, though. We might not shut our eyes exactly, but a lot of folks squint a lot.

I think I read somewhere where some mage said, "Never offer blood to any entity you would not share all secrets with." Like your man---er, Asir---Odin said, "Safest are secrets known to none." (Runesong)

Thanks. I might have very specific angle on the meat in the stores after visiting slaughterhouse. Some are really killing animals in very painless way I approve of, some less so.

Yes, very true! It's quite a topic: secrecy vs. sharing. On one side what you keep secret that is only yours and "safe," but it's what you share that get's strong connections with other people and/or gaining their opinions and criticism, which helps you grow.
Just came to my mind that we in fact share our blood quite literally with our family.

 

[Xenophon]

Thanks. I might have very specific angle on the meat in the stores after visiting slaughterhouse. Some are really killing animals in very painless way I approve of, some less so.

Yes, very true! It's quite a topic: secrecy vs. sharing. On one side what you keep secret that is only yours and "safe," but it's what you share that get's strong connections with other people and/or gaining their opinions and criticism, which helps you grow.
Just came to my mind that we in fact share our blood quite literally with our family.

I was making a joke there. The rationalizing tendency to say I am not complicit if I did not see it. Actually, I imagine one could only use halal meat, since it is allegedly humanely killed. Kosher too, I am told.

We share blood even a bit more widely than family. To have a country takes "Blut und Boden," after all.

 

[Sabbatius]

Outside of blooding a set of runes many years ago and the daemonic rites which require just a few drops or basic sigil activations, not much is utilized even for the squeamish. I have had to butcher chickens about once to twice a year, and sometimes the occasional goat. I once thought about using the blood from the animals, but then it dawned on me that I would be offering the spirits some goat and chicken blood. Nope. Mine is fine.

 

[Krauth]

there are a lot of people that use blood offering as part of their practice (even thou one drop is more than enough) people can go and went to great lengths to offer a lot more but i guess thats where peoples belief goes into question of "more is stronger, or more devotional"

i have used it myself in the far past as a beginner for energies i work with till this day.

blood is a very strong fluid that creates a connection to the offered target and connects the two its the same as saying "i give you a tiny piece of me"

so there is no problem with it just knowing why you are doing it and if you really need to
can be many reasons and many answers since we all walk our own path (i followed an LHP practitioner who since he started used blood offering for everything he did and never looked back, questioned or regretted it till his last breath) so its a matter of decision and action

other alternatives can be semen and basically anything else you make offerings in your day to day life so anything can come and go as one