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Perhaps I was a bit quick to make assumptions, I may have a bit of a hair trigger with this topic due to experiencing some pretty extreme judgments based on these factors, and I will apologize for assuming anyone's positions without full knowledge.
but every society has rules, values, guidelines for membership. the entire point of a club is to be around people that share your views and interests. i wouldn't have gotten this reaction if i said "i don't want people to join who enjoy the writing of Ayn Rand." even though it's essentially the same thing. it wasn't even a major part of the whole original comment, just a quick blurb about how i would like to run my secret society. says a lot when someone picks out that little part to make a statement against.
The Hall in Covent Garden? I wrote most of my doctoral thesis in its very quiet, very clean library. Some of the rooms are beautiful and I once entered one with the CBCS regalia still up which felt like walking onto the set of a Templar miniseries.
Oddly, given my predilections, I have mulled over Freemasonry across the years. On three separate occasions, I have made contact with a lodge, been received at interview with great enthusiasm by the brothers, only for something utterly out of the blue to occur to halt my initiation (father suddenly dying, a global pandemic, etc.).
I have concluded that the Egregore is troubled by me and guards itself against my presence. Because of all the evil.
Wait, so you believe the egregire of Masonry killed your father and established a worldwide crisis just to keep out of a time honored rite if passage for men?
Wait, so you believe the egregire of Masonry killed your father and established a worldwide crisis just to keep out of a time honored rite if passage for men?
I don’t think that’s what he meant. Just pointing out that something always seemed to thwart his attempt to join. More of a timing thing? And he’s taking it as a possible sign.
@Wintruz
Truth is, it would probably be less about the Masons egregore and more something coming from you that’s keeping you from joining.
“We’re not excluding you because you’re an X, we think it’s great you’re an X. We just don’t think you’ll be comfortable in our all Y group.
Our bigotry is completely honorable and not malicious at all. We promise! Truthfully it’s out of consideration for you that we’re excluding you. Come to think of it, you really should be thanking us.”
Gee, where have we heard that before?
You’re justifying the very thing(s) you claim to oppose.
Wait, so you believe the egregire of Masonry killed your father and established a worldwide crisis just to keep out of a time honored rite if passage for men?
Perhaps I was a bit quick to make assumptions, I may have a bit of a hair trigger with this topic due to experiencing some pretty extreme judgments based on these factors, and I will apologize for assuming anyone's positions without full knowledge.
but every society has rules, values, guidelines for membership. the entire point of a club is to be around people that share your views and interests. i wouldn't have gotten this reaction if i said "i don't want people to join who enjoy the writing of Ayn Rand." even though it's essentially the same thing. it wasn't even a major part of the whole original comment, just a quick blurb about how i would like to run my secret society. says a lot when someone picks out that little part to make a statement against.
Yeah, I am called "extreme right" and would not let a Randroid so much as lace the jack-boot I was going kick his butt with. You had a point. Have one still.
“We’re not excluding you because you’re an X, we think it’s great you’re an X. We just don’t think you’ll be comfortable in our all Y group.
Our bigotry is completely honorable and not malicious at all. We promise! Truthfully it’s out of consideration for you that we’re excluding you. Come to think of it, you really should be thanking us.”
Gee, where have we heard that before?
You’re justifying the very thing(s) you claim to oppose.
Take a gander at the Joy of Satan forum. (I'm not plugging it. I am not particularly welcome there for my views on creative eugenics. That and calling the clientele there LARP'ers.) In any case, aside from general forums, they have about 8-9 forums devoted to Satanists who are variously European, Turkish, Arab, Asian, Russian, black, and----"Oh gasp, those wicked men!"---white, English-speakers. One can jump around forums based on his interests/language abilities.
It seems to me that it's only folks on the Left who I've ever heard saying that admitting differences must lead to mass murder. Like the man said, "Before you shoot them, you do not have to ask questions about beliefs, just origins." The man was Lenin; the origins, class ones.
Xeno's Maxims 111: "' All men are the same'? A mensch which cannot discriminate among men cannot discriminate among his own impulses. He is as likely to kill on impulse as to befriend."
free masons are no longer secret, their ultimate secret that they hold so jealousy has become well known, even birds on trees sing their secret that was supposed to bring them power.
They are now on decline due to Jesuits who countered them for decades and undermined their work by sowing bad reputation about them.
I would say there is too much light, and that light is called religions which effortlessly fight against the occult for thousnads of years, yet the occult not only survived but is again on the rise, while as ironic as it is, count of believers drops every day and it's unlikely they will be able to rebuild that loss.
I've wanted to start one, but given my track record of self employment, it's probably safer I'd join an existing order.
In regard to creating a new order:
If you would start a secret society, what would be the aim of your society?
Reintegration of the human race.
What would be the secret about?
It's a secret.
How would you attract new members and based on what criteria would you select members?
Through platforms such as this. Seeking seekers, not worldly robots.
How should your society be organized, ex. should it be centralized or decentralized, online or real life?
Real life. Not sure beyond that. If fairness is key, then there would be opportunities for all.
Should there be a custom letter or similar to encrypt communication?
Yes. No unless not a join us letter. Secrets and crypto.
How much it would cost and how much effort it would take to maintain it?
Out of my league, for darn sure.
An idea a friend and I kicked around was one I'd thought about for over a year. A Magick lodge, where you come in, pay for time, do your working, and leave. The organization would handle shields wards and nightly banishing.
I've wanted to start one, but given my track record of self employment, it's probably safer I'd join an existing order.
In regard to creating a new order:
If you would start a secret society, what would be the aim of your society?
Reintegration of the human race.
What would be the secret about?
It's a secret.
How would you attract new members and based on what criteria would you select members?
Through platforms such as this. Seeking seekers, not worldly robots.
How should your society be organized, ex. should it be centralized or decentralized, online or real life?
Real life. Not sure beyond that. If fairness is key, then there would be opportunities for all.
Should there be a custom letter or similar to encrypt communication?
Yes. No unless not a join us letter. Secrets and crypto.
How much it would cost and how much effort it would take to maintain it?
Out of my league, for darn sure.
An idea a friend and I kicked around was one I'd thought about for over a year. A Magick lodge, where you come in, pay for time, do your working, and leave. The organization would handle shields wards and nightly banishing.
An idea a friend and I kicked around was one I'd thought about for over a year. A Magick lodge, where you come in, pay for time, do your working, and leave. The organization would handle shields wards and nightly banishing.* like one of the garages where they supply the tools and a work space?
Yes I have. The purpose? To be surrounded by people i can relate with to act more like a think tank with the goal not to look for power, but to simply understand the world in its deepest aspects. Power to me is not something i desire, i want something which transends the idea of power like harmony. What would be the need of power if you are aligned with the essence of power itself? I believe the focus on power would mask the rest of what existence has to offer thus limiting what informationn i can extract if my will is locked up in that persuit.
The application process to the order would have a very strict screening process which focuses mostly on the reaction of applicant to a set of questions. The purpose of this is to guage how they are as person, hence i would want zero emotionally minded people in the order. It would also require someone to have a general understanding of the world but at least one area they are confident that they know alot about — the general understanding part would be the most important as it would be a sign they are more consciously aware and not so much drifting in their subconscious mind throughout the day. Strong vocabulary and grammar skills would not be a requirement, but if they are skilled in this area it is a clear sign the person reads alot and may also be them trying to project themselves as being very intelligent (as they could be insecure about their intelligence, meaning they are likely emotionally minded).
Will i make this order? Probably not but its fun think about.
Problem with real life community is that people are spread around the world, even in a single country.
if you whish something big then virtual meetings in addition to real life is unavoidable, otherwise you know, the excuses are, I have to work and don't have time, I have a family, I can't afford it etc. so it's difficult to gather people in one place.
A magic lodge sounds very interesting! that's exactly something in my mind.
My idea would be to build an occult group where everybody would be desiring to achieve same goal, and for this to work there must be an inspiration that drives forward, an inspiration which makes you strive to give your time for the group to improve it.
A knowledge able to transform this world to the goals of the group.
Thus the secret would be that knowledge or inspiration which everybody naturally wants and gives the group power.
May I ask about which society it is a word?
Absolutely, as long as you're willing to bring chaos and darkness into this world I'm in!
Yes making time is the biggest issue. I do not like to ask for handouts but say if i was offered food, shelter, and internet access for free i would be a complete slave to studing and would be very happy doing that. Im a bit crazy when it comes to studying once i get into a groove with it, i can go as far as having zero social contact if i know i have valuable material in front of me.
I sound like a billionaires dream advisor, but i would never just want to be an advisor. I would want my own study to benefit me personally, and if the world comes next i would make that benefit as well if the ability did come in my hands to make that so.
I can only dream of such a thing that wont happen
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Now there was this one time when i was really big into crypto currency when i did formerily corun one of the most popular telegram call/AMA groups for cronos chain(crypto.com's blockchain) were i had a idea of making a internet crypto cult based tied to a meme token. This is diabolical stuff i was about to do, I actually did a ton of work on this project but then abandoned it based on my vision of it getting very out of control. Basically it was going to be a meme cult based on Kevin Bacon. I was going to copy the story of Jesus entirely and replace it with Kevin Bacon. I even had chants made that went "EVINK CONBA" which is an anagram of Kevin Bacon. I pretty much was going to be the high priest lol, and i was going to be the only one that can communicate with Kevin Bacon's spirit — plan was for me to play this role in telegram group and have weekly rituals always ending with a final thought just like jerry springer lol. When i would speak it would always be like magus of an order often referencing kevin bacons movies like "He has risen for his foot is loose." I was going to have a degree system of only 3 degrees just like the blue lodge of freemasonary.
The 1st degree would be entirely useless other than just you just being apart of the telegram group.
The second degree would be the one that requires you to stake a set ammount of tokens for at least a year (meaning they are locked and you cannot touch them) or it would be that you would have to send a certain ammount of tokens to a wallet adress which would be symbolized by kevin bacon's eternal flame (meaning the tokens will be burnt thus increasing the value of the tokens in circulation) lol. Of course i could take the morman church model of donating money like "you cant come to the temple if you do not pay your tithings," and just change that too "you must feed the eternal flame of kevin bacon to recieve his blessings and take part of our temple worship." So the temple benefits would be something like free whitelists for upcomming NFTs and other things (whitelists allow you buy an NFT at a cheaper price than listing). This 2nd degree would also have a optional duty (with a bigger incentive backing it if you did participate) to join twitter and telegram raids spamming pictures kevin bacon (that we make advertising the token with its website link) all writting "EVINK CONBA OUR SAVIOR IS COMING!!!" or something like that. The goal was to be as stupid as possible even raiding twitters that have absolutely nothing to do with crypto like the pope of catholic church lol. So it was completely designed to be fun for token investors which happen to be dominated by young people who have too much time on their hands and are immature enough to be attacted to this type of conduct.
Now when i started to constructing the 3rd degree thats when i stopped. It was a bit too insane what i wrote and i looked at myself and said "man i am fucked up" lol. So the idea was to make aquireing this degree almost impossible stating that the high priest (myself) is the only one that can approve you to this degree by your devotion to Kevin Bacon; however, as our savior has said he desires one person to go streaking at a highly publicized event chanting EVINK CONBA with body paint advertizing the token. Then at the bottom of this statement in very small lettering i was going to have a legal disclaimer saying that we of the evink conba token discourage you doing this, this is completely satire, and we are not liable if you do this etc.
So the telegram would be organized encouraging the members to welcome every new member when they come in with "EVINK CONBA BROTHER WELCOME." Also encouraged to great each other by "EVINK CONBA" as well before saying something like "goodmorning, or goodbye" The purpose of this was to imprint the chant in peoples minds as they spent time on our social media, so kind of a repetition type of thing so that it stays locked in their minds.
So this is summarized not exactly close to what i originally wrote but somewhere i have the whole plan and its pages long. As stupid as this may sounds for the older generations, if you witnessed what tokens were on these blockchains you would understand this would work.
So this example of what i can do if i apply myself to making a order or cult. Above is a mix of a cult and a order, and you can say it has a outer order (1st degree) and a inner order (2nd and 3rd degree).
Now there was this one time when i was really big into crypto currency when i did formerily corun one of the most popular telegram call/AMA groups for cronos chain(crypto.com's blockchain) were i had a idea of making a internet crypto cult based tied to a meme token. This is diabolical stuff i was about to do, I actually did a ton of work on this project but then abandoned it based on my vision of it getting very out of control. Basically it was going to be a meme cult based on Kevin Bacon. I was going to copy the story of Jesus entirely and replace it with Kevin Bacon. I even had chants made that went "EVINK CONBA" which is an anagram of Kevin Bacon. I pretty much was going to be the high priest lol, and i was going to be the only one that can communicate with Kevin Bacon's spirit — plan was for me to play this role in telegram group and have weekly rituals always ending with a final thought just like jerry springer lol. When i would speak it would always be like magus of an order often referencing kevin bacons movies like "He has risen for his foot is loose." I was going to have a degree system of only 3 degrees just like the blue lodge of freemasonary.
The 1st degree would be entirely useless other than just you just being apart of the telegram group.
The second degree would be the one that requires you to stake a set ammount of tokens for at least a year (meaning they are locked and you cannot touch them) or it would be that you would have to send a certain ammount of tokens to a wallet adress which would be symbolized by kevin bacon's eternal flame (meaning the tokens will be burnt thus increasing the value of the tokens in circulation) lol. Of course i could take the morman church model of donating money like "you cant come to the temple if you do not pay your tithings," and just change that too "you must feed the eternal flame of kevin bacon to recieve his blessings and take part of our temple worship." So the temple benefits would be something like free whitelists for upcomming NFTs and other things (whitelists allow you buy an NFT at a cheaper price than listing). This 2nd degree would also have a optional duty (with a bigger incentive backing it if you did participate) to join twitter and telegram raids spamming pictures kevin bacon (that we make advertising the token with its website link) all writting "EVINK CONBA OUR SAVIOR IS COMING!!!" or something like that. The goal was to be as stupid as possible even raiding twitters that have absolutely nothing to do with crypto like the pope of catholic church lol. So it was completely designed to be fun for token investors which happen to be dominated by young people who have too much time on their hands and are immature enough to be attacted to this type of conduct.
Now when i started to constructing the 3rd degree thats when i stopped. It was a bit too insane what i wrote and i looked at myself and said "man i am fucked up" lol. So the idea was to make aquireing this degree almost impossible stating that the high priest (myself) is the only one that can approve you to this degree by your devotion to Kevin Bacon; however, as our savior has said he desires one person to go streaking at a highly publicized event chanting EVINK CONBA with body paint advertizing the token. Then at the bottom of this statement in very small lettering i was going to have a legal disclaimer saying that we of the evink conba token discourage you doing this, this is completely satire, and we are not liable if you do this etc.
So the telegram would be organized encouraging the members to welcome every new member when they come in with "EVINK CONBA BROTHER WELCOME." Also encouraged to great each other by "EVINK CONBA" as well before saying something like "goodmorning, or goodbye" The purpose of this was to imprint the chant in peoples minds as they spent time on our social media, so kind of a repetition type of thing so that it stays locked in their minds.
So this is summarized not exactly close to what i originally wrote but somewhere i have the whole plan and its pages long. As stupid as this may sounds for the older generations, if you witnessed what tokens were on these blockchains you would understand this would work.
So this example of what i can do if i apply myself to making a order or cult. Above is a mix of a cult and a order, and you can say it has a outer order (1st degree) and a inner order (2nd and 3rd degree).
Yup, and am currently working on one. Problem is funding. We need a place to meet. Meeting in someone's basement or living room or garage is lame af! Sure it gets the job done but I live in a state that experiences all 4 seasons so the garage only works in Fall and Spring and I don't really want too many people all up in my house. So a separate building is needed which costs money. Then there's the rent/mortgage for the building and then the bills for the building. And the real estate market right now is insane. It's ridiculous.
free masons are no longer secret, their ultimate secret that they hold so jealousy has become well known, even birds on trees sing their secret that was supposed to bring them power.
They are now on decline due to Jesuits who countered them for decades and undermined their work by sowing bad reputation about them.
I would say there is too much light, and that light is called religions which effortlessly fight against the occult for thousnads of years, yet the occult not only survived but is again on the rise, while as ironic as it is, count of believers drops every day and it's unlikely they will be able to rebuild that loss.
As a Mason I can assure you and everyone else that may read this, the above statement is completely inaccurate. The depth to be found in this order is infinite, personally earth-shaking, and undeniable. It is open to all men of good report, but few enter. Many are satisfied to sit on the curb across from their local lodge and assume they know it all because they read a PDF copy Duncan's Monitor and Ritual, or The Hiram Key, or some old French lodge rite.
Anything you are able to find online will ONLY familiarize you with mechanics. There is much, MUCH more to experience, know, and understand that has never been put to paper.
As a Mason I can assure you and everyone else that may read this, the above statement is completely inaccurate. The depth to be found in this order is infinite, personally earth-shaking, and undeniable. It is open to all men of good report, but few enter. Many are satisfied to sit on the curb across from their local lodge and assume they know it all because they read a PDF copy Duncan's Monitor and Ritual, or The Hiram Key, or some old French lodge rite.
Anything you are able to find online will ONLY familiarize you with mechanics. There is much, MUCH more to experience, know, and understand that has never been put to paper.
I wouldn't oversell it, lest someone petition a lodge and be disappointed. Masonry is a great fraternity, but in my neck of the woods, esotericism is less likely to be discussed in the adjoining room than Model Ts or old-style batteries. Freemasonry is a great way to make friends as an adult, it puts you together in a room with people you'd otherwise have no reason to hang out with in a way that is usually restricted to schoolchildren, solving the problem of "How do I meet people now that I'm an adult?". The minimum requirement of belief in a creator serves an excellent dual purpose in both uniting believers without separating them by creed, and curtailing religious debate by establishing a common ground.
I hope you understand what I'm saying here. I think freemasonry has great value, I just don't think it's an avenue for someone looking to expand their occult knowledge. 99% of my conversations with fellow masons are mundane in nature.
Worth noting that I haven't joined the Scottish Rite. From what I've been told, there's more of the esoteric stuff in that body. But that's its own caveat for sideliners, the dues for Scottish Rite are twice as much as for blue lodge in my neck of the woods.
I wouldn't oversell it, lest someone petition a lodge and be disappointed. Masonry is a great fraternity, but in my neck of the woods, esotericism is less likely to be discussed in the adjoining room than Model Ts or old-style batteries. Freemasonry is a great way to make friends as an adult, it puts you together in a room with people you'd otherwise have no reason to hang out with in a way that is usually restricted to schoolchildren, solving the problem of "How do I meet people now that I'm an adult?". The minimum requirement of belief in a creator serves an excellent dual purpose in both uniting believers without separating them by creed, and curtailing religious debate by establishing a common ground.
I hope you understand what I'm saying here. I think freemasonry has great value, I just don't think it's an avenue for someone looking to expand their occult knowledge. 99% of my conversations with fellow masons are mundane in nature.
Worth noting that I haven't joined the Scottish Rite. From what I've been told, there's more of the esoteric stuff in that body. But that's its own caveat for sideliners, the dues for Scottish Rite are twice as much as for blue lodge in my neck of the woods.
I'm more of a listener than a talker, half the time I spend so long thinking about what to say that the conversation has moved on by the time I open my mouth.
I can see a personality difference in our post counts lol, you joined two weeks ago and have twice as many posts as I've made in four months. I come to this forum almost every day. I just read more than I post.
An answer to OP, because I neglected to address it in my post: I kind of have, in a sense, but I didn't do anything with them. I've started a handful of small-time cults with no real belief set, which maturity has shown me were really just cults of personality centered around me and led in part to the above mentioned "being more of a listener than a talker". I just have that bit of majiqal whatever that makes people listen to what I have to say (my wife says it's my loud voice), so I've grown to pay more attention to what I say, since it seems to get weighted more importantly by people even if what I'm saying isn't that important.
I'm more of a listener than a talker, half the time I spend so long thinking about what to say that the conversation has moved on by the time I open my mouth.
I can see a personality difference in our post counts lol, you joined two weeks ago and have twice as many posts as I've made in four months. I come to this forum almost every day. I just read more than I post.
An answer to OP, because I neglected to address it in my post: I kind of have, in a sense, but I didn't do anything with them. I've started a handful of small-time cults with no real belief set, which maturity has shown me were really just cults of personality centered around me and led in part to the above mentioned "being more of a listener than a talker". I just have that bit of majiqal whatever that makes people listen to what I have to say (my wife says it's my loud voice), so I've grown to pay more attention to what I say, since it seems to get weighted more importantly by people even if what I'm saying isn't that important.
I'm more of a listener than a talker, half the time I spend so long thinking about what to say that the conversation has moved on by the time I open my mouth.
I can see a personality difference in our post counts lol, you joined two weeks ago and have twice as many posts as I've made in four months. I come to this forum almost every day. I just read more than I post.
An answer to OP, because I neglected to address it in my post: I kind of have, in a sense, but I didn't do anything with them. I've started a handful of small-time cults with no real belief set, which maturity has shown me were really just cults of personality centered around me and led in part to the above mentioned "being more of a listener than a talker". I just have that bit of majiqal whatever that makes people listen to what I have to say (my wife says it's my loud voice), so I've grown to pay more attention to what I say, since it seems to get weighted more importantly by people even if what I'm saying isn't that important.
We cannot conceal our ideas and blame others for not hearing them. I understand that each lodge operates differently and is a vessel for many different types of people, but if you feel you cannot speak and have dialog about things that we talk about here at the lodge or with lodge brothers outside of the lodge, then it is time to visit other lodges or propose something at an opportune time. Many people, brothers included, do not understand the depth there is within the tradition, and there is certainly room for it. I encourage you to exert your efforts to shape the lodge to your needs. You never know when a future brother may enter in need of the very things you hold dear.
We cannot conceal our ideas and blame others for not hearing them. I understand that each lodge operates differently and is a vessel for many different types of people, but if you feel you cannot speak and have dialog about things that we talk about here at the lodge or with lodge brothers outside of the lodge, then it is time to visit other lodges or propose something at an opportune time. Many people, brothers included, do not understand the depth there is within the tradition, and there is certainly room for it. I encourage you to exert your efforts to shape the lodge to your needs. You never know when a future brother may enter in need of the very things you hold dear.
The thing you're describing kind of happened recently. A brother joined who told me he offered a prayer to the Norse gods before a meal (he noticed the tiwaz tattoo on my finger), so I directed him to look up the term "asatru", which he'd never heard of before. Then we bonded over the mutual appreciation of heavy cream in coffee. Thank you for reminding me why I love lodge lol.
As a Mason I can assure you and everyone else that may read this, the above statement is completely inaccurate. The depth to be found in this order is infinite, personally earth-shaking, and undeniable. It is open to all men of good report, but few enter. Many are satisfied to sit on the curb across from their local lodge and assume they know it all because they read a PDF copy Duncan's Monitor and Ritual, or The Hiram Key, or some old French lodge rite.
Anything you are able to find online will ONLY familiarize you with mechanics. There is much, MUCH more to experience, know, and understand that has never been put to paper.
I agree with you not being a mason and have studied freemasonary. I have accepted that i will never know what freemason knows not being in the fraternity. I only have one freemason in my family but hes long dead who is my great grandfather. He was a shriner and i wish he was alive so i could talk to him.
