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I grew up Buddhist, I am not anymore. Still I pray once in a while to hedge my best in the afterlife, it seems like my Buddhist practices are actively interfering with my magick spells to improve my life i.e increase iq, etc.
I've gotten alot of good results from Gallery of Magick's books but something about Buddhism doesn't seem to like the fact that I am enjoying my life and infact now that my life is better I noticed Buddhism actually exacerbated my mental and emotional issues rather than solve it.
Hemingway said we spend our lives trying to escape familial influences. Those influences include the religion one was reared in. There are some strains of magick that advise one to do acts that run counter to his earlier beliefs. This, indeed, is the point of rites like the Black Mass. BUT, one is to do these as a phase in his training. It is not meant to become a new way of life. Also one needs a great deal of self-knowledge and insight. The practice can destroy some individuals while being catharsis for others.
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Isn't OP's point that he was into it? That, like Br'er Rabbit and Tar Baby, he can't get unstuck? In which case it's relevant.
The issue I guess is that I have been sort of indoctrinated? Religion was used more as a control tool for me so it brings up alot of uncomfortable feelings even when I am not practicing and I do wonder what happens to us after death hence the hedging the bet part.
Although I will probably have to abandoned it soon, if it's actively preventing me from living a happy life I don't really know what's the point since if you live a sad and resentful life then you'll technically be creating more bad karma.
If you're asking which tenants I have a problem with it, I guess it's the idea that karma and that everything you enjoy is probably going to land you in Hell or in the Animal realm unless it's Buddhism.
In Vajrayana there seems to be alot of built in thought-policing as well as the idea that you need to suffer and burn through all your karma but at the same time it's here to 'teach you a lesson' and 'enlighten you' I guess that's why it conflicts with my magick, it also generally views foreign magick afaik as making deal with worldly beings that you will probably have to pay back later akin to owing your drug dealer some money.
Interestingly, I had a similar experience with religious forms which I was raised within.
I'd hazard that any blockages are not inherent in the form but in what the form means to you. In other words, it's not the Buddha intervening to stop you from having a good time. The likelihood is that you have stored energy in your idea of Buddhism (the Buddhist school is irrelevant at this individualised level) and that you have unfinished work to do there. If you have found meaning in Buddhism or if it has "worked" for you at any stage then you can increase that likelihood a hundred-fold.
You may well come back to your childhood practices once you have attained a measure of success through what you're presently practicing. Buddhism may be "anchoring" you to something that you need later but it won't hamper your magical experiments provided that those experiments do not violate your conscience.
You touch on an important point I am trying to figure out whether these feelings are from the Religious trauma paired with the childhood abuse I experienced or something more, because it often feels like my inner voice but it's very aggressive and often gives destructive commands for me to do.
Most magi wind up complicating their life trying to perfect it. Happiness is like tumescence. One no sooner gets it than he starts trying to f*** with it.
Actually Xenophon you're right, part of the reason I was drawn into Buddhism and probably am still stuck is one my abusive family used it as a tool to control me, and two later in life I experienced alot of difficulties and used it as a coping mechanism so to speak that I was just burning away bad karma and that things will improve.
Of course I no longer believe such a thing, although the fear from my childhood still compels me to pray. Otherwise I would've probably buried away and forgotten about it.
My life is still difficult but it seems magick presents solutions where as Buddhism seems to actively create problems for me repeatedly, over, and over with no signs of stopping.
Seems I might've misread your question, I think you're asking about my motivation for still retaining some of my practices. Mainly fear, I grew up in a household that use Religion to control their children and was subjugated to alot of images of people being tortured and was told that would be me if I didn't practice the Religion that's all.
I was also actually pretty involved in it for a few years at least enough to learn terminology and get some empowerments. I think I quit about 1 - 2 years ago off the top of my head.
If you're asking which tenants I have a problem with it, I guess it's the idea that karma and that everything you enjoy is probably going to land you in Hell or in the Animal realm unless it's Buddhism.
I just get this very fearful feeling internally. I've always been plagued by intrusive thoughts to my background with Buddhism and self-policing, I was doing fine the first week and I actually started to develop useful instincts and thoughts. I felt like I had the ability to control my life again but I would get very invasive feelings and thoughts telling me that I am striking bargains with Demons, and that by overcoming my fate I will accrue bad karma and that bad things can only happen to me in this life because I have severely bad karma.
So it seems like by practicing any bit of Buddhism these feelings arise, it feels the same as my intuition. A commenter in this earlier post mentioned that it could be my version of Buddhism, I was considering completely abandoning Buddhism it feels right in a way ... I have a calm internal voice telling me to do it, but then there's also a really stressed out voice telling me not to do it. Almost feels like a compulsion, I started this thread to see if anyone had similar experiences so I can make my choices.
My life certainly seems to improve due to magick, it's not just in physical/material gains, whenever I tried to calm my cravings in Buddhism practicing it seems to make it FLARE up.
NDEs don't suggest to me that incarnating here is mandatory. Since we are now discussing spirituality and your therapy. In terms of Buddhism, there is also Buddhism that just tries to get a better next life, amidsm etc.
Various Buddhist temples I've visited here in China and Thailand too have pretty graphic murals, carvings of their take on Hell. Westerners tend to take their Dharma with plenty of sanitizer. Sort of a "The Care Bears Get Satori!" drama.
NDEs don't suggest to me that incarnating here is mandatory. Since we are now discussing spirituality and your therapy. In terms of Buddhism, there is also Buddhism that just tries to get a better next life, amidsm etc.
Funny enough Pure Lands is where I first started, their concern is to get to a better next life but it's incredibly difficult you have to give up worldly pleasures and pray 24/7 essentially. You basically need to attain a pure Samadhi where all you chant in your head is Amitabha if you have a slight thought about anything else at the time of death you end up in the Wheel of Reincarnation or since you are chanting possibly tricked by Demons and end up in Hell.
Funny enough Pure Lands is where I first started, their concern is to get to a better next life but it's incredibly difficult you have to give up worldly pleasures and pray 24/7 essentially. You basically need to attain a pure Samadhi where all you chant in your head is Amitabha if you have a slight thought about anything else at the time of death you end up in the Wheel of Reincarnation or since you are chanting possibly tricked by Demons and end up in Hell.
I know a few Pure Land Buddhists here in China. Some of them are quite serious about it; none labors under the lurid strictures you mention. I think your kindred are making a relatively moderate creed into a monster. On the other hand, mental recitation of a mantra 24/7 is far preferable than Facebook. I have a (very non-Buddhist) mantra that, after some few months practice slips in unoccupied mental space and bars the door against this dying culture's dreck.
I know a few Pure Land Buddhists here in China. Some of them are quite serious about it; none labors under the lurid strictures you mention. I think your kindred are making a relatively moderate creed into a monster. On the other hand, mental recitation of a mantra 24/7 is far preferable than Facebook. I have a (very non-Buddhist) mantra that, after some few months practice slips in unoccupied mental space and bars the door against this dying culture's dreck.
You should check out the lectures of Hsuan Hua and Chin Kung, Hsuan Hua was a famous patriarch of the Chan school but also did Pureland while Chin Kung does exclusively Pureland based.
Also the mantras aren't too much of an issue if you chant mindlessly but to make it to Amitabha's pure abode then you need to essentially be consumed by the mantra prayers, you can still make it if you do it mindlessly but you have a lesser chance depending on your karma. It's a big fear tactic they use, don't worry about your children, don't worry or be attached to your wife, eventually you will die and that's all that matters be prepared for that time.
I don't know how intense those Buddhists are but the canon texts are pretty hardcore and even the Monks at the temples I've met practice and advocated lay people practice this way.
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I hope the NDEs are right if we aren't forced back, that'd be great. I am just afraid due to some of the stuff I've heard growing up.
NDEs don't suggest to me that incarnating here is mandatory. Since we are now discussing spirituality and your therapy. In terms of Buddhism, there is also Buddhism that just tries to get a better next life, amidsm etc.
You should check out the lectures of Hsuan Hua and Chin Kung, Hsuan Hua was a famous patriarch of the Chan school but also did Pureland while Chin Kung does exclusively Pureland based.
Also the mantras aren't too much of an issue if you chant mindlessly but to make it to Amitabha's pure abode then you need to essentially be consumed by the mantra prayers, you can still make it if you do it mindlessly but you have a lesser chance depending on your karma. It's a big fear tactic they use, don't worry about your children, don't worry or be attached to your wife, eventually you will die and that's all that matters be prepared for that time.
I don't know how intense those Buddhists are but the canon texts are pretty hardcore and even the Monks at the temples I've met practice and advocated lay people practice this way.
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I hope the NDEs are right if we aren't forced back, that'd be great. I am just afraid due to some of the stuff I've heard growing up.
Funny enough Pure Lands is where I first started, their concern is to get to a better next life but it's incredibly difficult you have to give up worldly pleasures and pray 24/7 essentially.
I grew up Buddhist, I am not anymore. Still I pray once in a while to hedge my best in the afterlife, it seems like my Buddhist practices are actively interfering with my magick spells to improve my life i.e increase iq, etc.
I've gotten alot of good results from Gallery of Magick's books but something about Buddhism doesn't seem to like the fact that I am enjoying my life and infact now that my life is better I noticed Buddhism actually exacerbated my mental and emotional issues rather than solve it.
Interesting situation. A lot has been said already and I agree with that, there are two kinds of blocks in your way,I guess that you are dealing with both:
Internal: your faith and programming telling you what is right, but no longer fitting with the path that you follow
External: people around you, or people you have connection with having their own opinion on what is right and passively or actively influencing you.
Dealing with internal programming is what i like to call a problem of a scientist, who is trying to prove his theory but ends up with big evidence that it's wrong. Then he must give up and let go of it. You said that your internal voice tells you to leave buddhism but you cannot. I cannot see into your mind to tell you which way is the true one for you, you have to find it and follow it.
It can get more difficult when people around you are influencing you and there is always someone. I hate when Christians pray for me, because always it ends with some spirit in angel shape coming to me trying to influence me. That is form of magic although they do not see it so they cannot admit it. So I keep clearing my personal space from these spirits and energies that do not belong to me and would manipulate me the way I do not wish to go. I have to watch what is in my mind and what does and doesn't belong with me.
As with your afterlife, in my experience things are never exactly as we expect. Sometimes very far off what we expect. Even if described correctly, it ends to be something different because what we read or hear makes us form an idea from our understanding. Actually hearing that someone would achieve some place by being consumed by mantra feels scary to me. last thing I would like to become is a radio constantly playing one song for someone's pleasure.
Us Westerners may know quite a bit about Buddhist philosphy (or have at least read books about it) and have a rough idea what monks do all day but are probably ignorant as to what a Buddhist education looks like or what common people practice in everyday life. Lighting joss sticks at shrines, tending spirit houses (ok, not exactly a Buddist practice) or dropping coins in bowls in front of statues of the Buddha like I observed in Thailand can't be the whole story... is there such a thing as services or ceremonies at temples involving the laiety? Buddhism has such a good image of a 'cool' religion that it's hard to imagine how it can be twisted by cruel parents to traumatize a child... although I guess you can always scare a child with descriptions of the could and hot hells, I suppose, just like fundie Christians. Or with exhortations to be a good kid or else the evil spirits will get you.
Us Westerners may know quite a bit about Buddhist philosphy (or have at least read books about it) and have a rough idea what monks do all day but are probably ignorant as to what a Buddhist education looks like or what common people practice in everyday life. Lighting joss sticks at shrines, tending spirit houses (ok, not exactly a Buddist practice) or dropping coins in bowls in front of statues of the Buddha like I observed in Thailand can't be the whole story... is there such a thing as services or ceremonies at temples involving the laiety? Buddhism has such a good image of a 'cool' religion that it's hard to imagine how it can be twisted by cruel parents to traumatize a child... although I guess you can always scare a child with descriptions of the could and hot hells, I suppose, just like fundie Christians. Or with exhortations to be a good kid or else the evil spirits will get you.
While I was sojourning at a Wat in Nonthaburi, Thailand, two monks from one wat stabbed and killed one from another wat. Apparently there was a dispute about whose begging-turf a certain street was in. Likewise, various Tibetan orders from time to time accuse one another of witchcraft. Philip Kapleau's (Three Pillars of Zen) roshi, Hakuun Yasutani was an outspoken apologist for Japan's invasion of China in the 30's and 40's. Sogyal Rinpoche was, by many accounts, a lecher, as was Chogyam Trungpa. Bottom Line: people have feet of clay and every creed has some less than shining exemplars. A lot of Buddhism's mystique is due to Western yearnings. In a twisted take on fundamentalism, Americans seem to opt for the literal word-for-word inerrancy of that old flick about Shangri La, "Lost Horizon."
Yeah Honen and Shinran, developed the Pureland faith further and started the trend of renouncing other Buddhist practices i.e meditation, sutra reading, etc since it was unviable and difficult for the laymen populations of their time. Honen however was still quite critical that you needed to chant un-endingly without ending your attention on Amitabha's name while Shinran himself sort of implied that he would be lost in reincarnation anyways but to use the name of Amitabha as an anchor so that you may reach a sufficient life time where you have sufficient Samadhi to reach the Purelands.
This of course were huge deviation from the main practice of Pureland Buddhism which was at that time derived from the Tiandai/Tientai schools. In those schools there were stories of Monks being able to spit out light from their mouth from single-mindedly chanting Amitabha, like I said you don't need to take my word you can look at Hsuan Hua or Chin Kung both very venerable monks who are the head of the Chan/Pureland faction in Chian respectively.
Us Westerners may know quite a bit about Buddhist philosphy (or have at least read books about it) and have a rough idea what monks do all day but are probably ignorant as to what a Buddhist education looks like or what common people practice in everyday life. Lighting joss sticks at shrines, tending spirit houses (ok, not exactly a Buddist practice) or dropping coins in bowls in front of statues of the Buddha like I observed in Thailand can't be the whole story... is there such a thing as services or ceremonies at temples involving the laiety? Buddhism has such a good image of a 'cool' religion that it's hard to imagine how it can be twisted by cruel parents to traumatize a child... although I guess you can always scare a child with descriptions of the could and hot hells, I suppose, just like fundie Christians. Or with exhortations to be a good kid or else the evil spirits will get you.
Growing up I was told that if I even had angry thoughts towards my parents I would end up in Hell, this included angry thoughts from receiving beatings and bullying from them. I was told people disliked me in School due to my bad karma and I am simply a bad person with bad karma and I deserve the abuse given to me, if I ever tried to fight back I would earn more bad karma.
One time I remember my father beating me rather badly and I started crying and getting really frustrated, my mother told me that he is my father and asked me how I dared to be angry at him. She then proceeded to tell me about the possible punishments I will face in Hell.
I don't know if we have a Buddhist expert here. Nor do I consider it necessary to convert you. I have limited knowledge of Buddhism. I primarily suggest that you have limited knowledge. You don't feel like someone to me whose much looked into Buddhism. You don't feel like someone whose much looked into the occult either. You have some bad experience with your heritage, and ask if your vague limited background in Buddhism is interfering with your vague limited practice in the occult.
I dunno. Whatever.
As for Pure Land - while they would generally advise it's practice, based on having read some Honen or certainly Shinran, I don't get the impression that continual practice is necessary to be "saved", so much as that one might benefit. I can comment from my own minor experience with it that unending chanting is not necessary to get results from it. I don't think chanting is a necessary component at all.
" by the efficacy of the ancient prayer of that Tathagata, those who think of and remember him shall certainly be able to accomplish their aim."
"the beings who will be born in the middle form of the highest grade are those who do not necessarily learn, remember, study, or recite those Vaipulya Sutras, but fully understand the meaning of the truth contained in them, and having a firm grasp of the highest truth do not speak evil of the Mahayana doctrine, but deeply believe in (the principle of) cause and effect"
Simplification into chanting is, if I recall, Honen. I would have to read Honen again, but I do not think this is the point. The chanting is a simplification so that more people can do it. If you cannot remember the Buddha Amitabha, then just chant him, you can improve your station that way. The doctrine that you will go to hell if your practice fails - this is contrary to what I understand of it. Whores go to the Pure Land. Maybe someone with some extreme variety of sin does not go there.
Five Grave Offenses (killing one's father, killing one's mother, killing an arhat, shedding the blood of a Buddha, and creating a schism in the Sangha) might find it challenging to be reborn in the Pure Land without sincere repentance.
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If there are good men or good women who hear of Amitabha Buddha, and recite his name singlemindedly and without confusion, for one day or two days or three days or four days or five days or six days or seven days, then when these people are about to die, Amitabha Buddha and all the sages who are with him will appear before them. When these people die, their minds will not fall into delusion, and they will attain rebirth in Amitabha Buddha's Land of Ultimate Bliss."
