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Anyone find that your Religion/God messes with your magick and actively ruins your life?

HocusPocus

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I grew up Buddhist, I am not anymore. Still I pray once in a while to hedge my best in the afterlife, it seems like my Buddhist practices are actively interfering with my magick spells to improve my life i.e increase iq, etc.

I've gotten alot of good results from Gallery of Magick's books but something about Buddhism doesn't seem to like the fact that I am enjoying my life and infact now that my life is better I noticed Buddhism actually exacerbated my mental and emotional issues rather than solve it.
 

Ziran

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Can you elaborate that?

It's easy. People conjure their demons in order to avoid personal responsibility. Then they knock down their own demons, and it gives them a psychological boost. It's some of the most common, often executed , least recognized, bits of sorcery. But it's counter-productive.
 

KjEno186

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Subtle insinuations that one's own personal gnosis is superior to another's does little credit to one's own beliefs. Most people reading this thread would agree that religions are divided enough as it is. One person's god is another's devil. Christians murdered one another en masse in the 20th Century, and it is a rare creed which has no sects or internal divisions awaiting a catalyst for schism. What sort of responsibility is that? 'Avoiding responsibility' could also be called 'victim blaming' since there's really no way to know the context for another person's statements of belief. Consider the possibility that the ethical atheist simply cannot abide being lied to.
 

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Subtle insinuations that one's own personal gnosis is superior to another's does little credit to one's own beliefs

So, someone asks for help and advice, but, that help should never correct misconceptions?

That's a terrible idea.

The subtle insinuation is not from me. I'm about as subtle as a bowling ball being sent down the lane.

Get real.
 

Jackson

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Christians murdered one another en masse in the 20th Century, and it is a rare creed which has no sects or internal divisions awaiting a catalyst for schism.
After Confucius and Mo Tzŭ, the Literati have divided into eight schools and the Mohists into three. In what they accept and what they reject they are contrary to and different from one another but each claims to be orthodox Confucian or Mohist. Now that Confucius and Mo Tzŭ cannot come to life again, who can determine the orthodoxy of learned men?

Confucius and Mo Tzŭ both followed Yao and Shun; they differed in matters of acceptance and rejection, yet each claimed to be the true Yao and Shun. Now that Yao and Shun cannot come to life again, who is going to determine genuineness as between the Literati and the Mohists? For our people, who have passed through the time of Yü and Hsia upwards of seven hundred years, and through the Yin and Zhou Dynasties upwards of two thousand years, it is impossible to determine whether the Literati or the Mohists are right.

Now, if anybody wants to scrutinize the ways of Yao and Shun that appeared three thousand years ago, it seems far from possible merely to imagine that! To be sure of anything that has no corroborating evidence, is stupid; to abide by anything that one can not be sure of, is self-deceptive. Therefore, those who openly quote the early kings and dogmatically uphold Yao and Shun, must be deceitful, if not stupid. Such stupid and deceptive learning and heretical and contradictory conduct, the intelligent sovereign never approves.

The Mohists, for funeral rites wear winter clothes in winter days and summer clothes in summer days, make coffins three inches thick of Paulownia wood, and observe only three months' mourning. Regarding this as restraint, sovereigns of this age respect them. The Literati, on the contrary, for funeral rites break up the household property and give sons in pawn to compensate for the losses, observe three years' mourning till they break down in health and have to walk with the aid of canes.

Regarding this as an act of filial piety, sovereigns of this age respect them. But, in fact, to approve the restraint of Mo Tzŭ one has to reprove Confucius for his extravagance; to approve the filial piety of Confucius one has to reprove Mo Tzŭ for his impiety. Now, piety and impiety, restraint and extravagance, all are found among the Literati and the Mohists, and the superiors respect them equally.

Inasmuch as stupid and deceptive studies and heretical and contradictory theories are in conflict while the lords of men tolerate them equally, the gentry within the seas have neither definite forms of speech nor constant standards of conduct. Indeed, ice and charcoal do not share the same vessel and last long; winter and summer do not come at the same time.

Likewise, heretical and contradictory studies do not stand together and have peace. Now that heretical studies are equally listened to and contradictory theories are absurdly acted upon, how can there be other than chaos? If the ruler listens so carelessly and acts so absurdly, the same must be true when he rules over men.

As to the subordinates of the intelligent sovereign, prime ministers must have arisen from among the district-magistrates and gallant generals must have emerged from among the squads of soldiers. If persons who have rendered meritorious services are always rewarded, then the greater ranks and bounties become the better encouraged they will be.

Again, if offices are elevated and ranks are raised, then the greater the official responsibilities become the more they will promote political order. Indeed, according as ranks and bounties are raised official responsibilities promote political order, this is the royal road to supremacy.
 

Xenophon

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Subtle insinuations that one's own personal gnosis is superior to another's does little credit to one's own beliefs. Most people reading this thread would agree that religions are divided enough as it is. One person's god is another's devil. Christians murdered one another en masse in the 20th Century, and it is a rare creed which has no sects or internal divisions awaiting a catalyst for schism. What sort of responsibility is that? 'Avoiding responsibility' could also be called 'victim blaming' since there's really no way to know the context for another person's statements of belief. Consider the possibility that the ethical atheist simply cannot abide being lied to.
I had rather know where someone's loyalties lie than have him pretend to non-extant "objectivity." That aside, what Tom calls a "subtle insinuation," Dick might think simple courtesy of understating his beliefs. If it reflects discredit on him, so be it. Pretending to be neutral has never prevented conflict.
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After Confucius and Mo Tzŭ, the Literati have divided into eight schools and the Mohists into three. In what they accept and what they reject they are contrary to and different from one another but each claims to be orthodox Confucian or Mohist. Now that Confucius and Mo Tzŭ cannot come to life again, who can determine the orthodoxy of learned men?

Confucius and Mo Tzŭ both followed Yao and Shun; they differed in matters of acceptance and rejection, yet each claimed to be the true Yao and Shun. Now that Yao and Shun cannot come to life again, who is going to determine genuineness as between the Literati and the Mohists? For our people, who have passed through the time of Yü and Hsia upwards of seven hundred years, and through the Yin and Zhou Dynasties upwards of two thousand years, it is impossible to determine whether the Literati or the Mohists are right.

Now, if anybody wants to scrutinize the ways of Yao and Shun that appeared three thousand years ago, it seems far from possible merely to imagine that! To be sure of anything that has no corroborating evidence, is stupid; to abide by anything that one can not be sure of, is self-deceptive. Therefore, those who openly quote the early kings and dogmatically uphold Yao and Shun, must be deceitful, if not stupid. Such stupid and deceptive learning and heretical and contradictory conduct, the intelligent sovereign never approves.

The Mohists, for funeral rites wear winter clothes in winter days and summer clothes in summer days, make coffins three inches thick of Paulownia wood, and observe only three months' mourning. Regarding this as restraint, sovereigns of this age respect them. The Literati, on the contrary, for funeral rites break up the household property and give sons in pawn to compensate for the losses, observe three years' mourning till they break down in health and have to walk with the aid of canes.

Regarding this as an act of filial piety, sovereigns of this age respect them. But, in fact, to approve the restraint of Mo Tzŭ one has to reprove Confucius for his extravagance; to approve the filial piety of Confucius one has to reprove Mo Tzŭ for his impiety. Now, piety and impiety, restraint and extravagance, all are found among the Literati and the Mohists, and the superiors respect them equally.

Inasmuch as stupid and deceptive studies and heretical and contradictory theories are in conflict while the lords of men tolerate them equally, the gentry within the seas have neither definite forms of speech nor constant standards of conduct. Indeed, ice and charcoal do not share the same vessel and last long; winter and summer do not come at the same time.

Likewise, heretical and contradictory studies do not stand together and have peace. Now that heretical studies are equally listened to and contradictory theories are absurdly acted upon, how can there be other than chaos? If the ruler listens so carelessly and acts so absurdly, the same must be true when he rules over men.

As to the subordinates of the intelligent sovereign, prime ministers must have arisen from among the district-magistrates and gallant generals must have emerged from among the squads of soldiers. If persons who have rendered meritorious services are always rewarded, then the greater ranks and bounties become the better encouraged they will be.

Again, if offices are elevated and ranks are raised, then the greater the official responsibilities become the more they will promote political order. Indeed, according as ranks and bounties are raised official responsibilities promote political order, this is the royal road to supremacy.
OK, OK , nice book report there. Can you sum it up in one sentence for those who aren't keen on ingesting "War & Peace" before breakfast?
 

Wintruz

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After Confucius and Mo Tzŭ, the Literati have divided into eight schools and the Mohists into three. In what they accept and what they reject they are contrary to and different from one another but each claims to be orthodox Confucian or Mohist. Now that Confucius and Mo Tzŭ cannot come to life again, who can determine the orthodoxy of learned men?

Confucius and Mo Tzŭ both followed Yao and Shun; they differed in matters of acceptance and rejection, yet each claimed to be the true Yao and Shun. Now that Yao and Shun cannot come to life again, who is going to determine genuineness as between the Literati and the Mohists? For our people, who have passed through the time of Yü and Hsia upwards of seven hundred years, and through the Yin and Zhou Dynasties upwards of two thousand years, it is impossible to determine whether the Literati or the Mohists are right.

Now, if anybody wants to scrutinize the ways of Yao and Shun that appeared three thousand years ago, it seems far from possible merely to imagine that! To be sure of anything that has no corroborating evidence, is stupid; to abide by anything that one can not be sure of, is self-deceptive. Therefore, those who openly quote the early kings and dogmatically uphold Yao and Shun, must be deceitful, if not stupid. Such stupid and deceptive learning and heretical and contradictory conduct, the intelligent sovereign never approves.

The Mohists, for funeral rites wear winter clothes in winter days and summer clothes in summer days, make coffins three inches thick of Paulownia wood, and observe only three months' mourning. Regarding this as restraint, sovereigns of this age respect them. The Literati, on the contrary, for funeral rites break up the household property and give sons in pawn to compensate for the losses, observe three years' mourning till they break down in health and have to walk with the aid of canes.

Regarding this as an act of filial piety, sovereigns of this age respect them. But, in fact, to approve the restraint of Mo Tzŭ one has to reprove Confucius for his extravagance; to approve the filial piety of Confucius one has to reprove Mo Tzŭ for his impiety. Now, piety and impiety, restraint and extravagance, all are found among the Literati and the Mohists, and the superiors respect them equally.

Inasmuch as stupid and deceptive studies and heretical and contradictory theories are in conflict while the lords of men tolerate them equally, the gentry within the seas have neither definite forms of speech nor constant standards of conduct. Indeed, ice and charcoal do not share the same vessel and last long; winter and summer do not come at the same time.

Likewise, heretical and contradictory studies do not stand together and have peace. Now that heretical studies are equally listened to and contradictory theories are absurdly acted upon, how can there be other than chaos? If the ruler listens so carelessly and acts so absurdly, the same must be true when he rules over men.

As to the subordinates of the intelligent sovereign, prime ministers must have arisen from among the district-magistrates and gallant generals must have emerged from among the squads of soldiers. If persons who have rendered meritorious services are always rewarded, then the greater ranks and bounties become the better encouraged they will be.

Again, if offices are elevated and ranks are raised, then the greater the official responsibilities become the more they will promote political order. Indeed, according as ranks and bounties are raised official responsibilities promote political order, this is the royal road to supremacy.
I'm no expert on WF etiquette but cite your sources if you're quoting them so that others can delve deeper if they wish to. The original text from which this quote is taken can be found
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Jackson

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OK, OK , nice book report there. Can you sum it up in one sentence for those who aren't keen on ingesting "War & Peace" before breakfast?
I'm no expert on WF etiquette but cite your sources if you're quoting them so that others can delve deeper if they wish to. The original text from which this quote is taken can be found
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
.
Two different words cannot be equally precious nor can two different laws be equally appropriate. If anybody, not authorized by laws and orders, attempts to cope with foreign intrigues, guard against civil disturbances, produce public benefit, or manage state affairs, his superior should heed his word and hold it accountable for an equivalent fact. If the word turns out true, he should receive a big reward: if not true, he should suffer a heavy penalty. Therefore, stupid persons fear punishment and dare not speak, and intelligent persons find nothing to dispute. Such is the reason why in the state of an enlightened sovereign there is neither dispute nor controversy.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
 

Ziran

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Two different words cannot be equally precious

Sometimes they can. Power, magical power, originates from the heart and mind operating in unison and articulated in words. Because individuals are, precisely that, individuals , establishing a unity between heart and mind such that the human will is being expressed in word, naturally, will vary to a degree. For some more than others.

The differing sects which you described may, maybe, be cultivating from two different streams which are being fed from the same spring. And, tbh, they could be completely different streams from different sources. That doesn't matter at all, right?

However, the way to tell if their teachings are sound, is no different than any teaching, any practice, from any culture, at any time in history. Does it make sense? Does it work consistently? Does it compromise the intellect? Or does it expand it? Is it a crutch? A shortcut, tempting, yet error prone? Etc ...

People online seem to be too sensitive about guarding their precious ego which was developed via some DIY, self-directed,online, kabalah-for-dummies course. Not to mention the rank liberal political bias wafting from the moderator's passive aggressive attempted rebuke.
 
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KjEno186

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Pretending to be neutral has never prevented conflict.
I am not neutral. The only conflicts that matter in my life are those I have with my own flesh and blood precisely because they adhere to beliefs which I have rejected. I would gladly leave them to their religion, yet part of their indoctrination involves conversion. Furthermore, they are taught to shun those who leave their religion. Imagine the certainty they must have in their beliefs, or at the very minimum the sunk cost psychology involved which could motivate some family members to reject association with others. For example, the JWs openly ridicule other Christians who baptize infants, yet they strongly encourage children, even preteens, to get baptized into the faith. Then the child becomes an adult, and what if for some reason he now realizes that the faith of his parents makes no sense? He could decide to remain, unhappily going through the motions. Or he could be honest with his parents and risk being shunned by them.

I'm not sure if a god is actually behind the egregore of the JWs, seeing as how they put Jesus in second place and really, really spend a lot of time harping on the Old Testament stories. It sure has made navigating my life more...interesting. Despite their programming, I am still close to my family. That which doesn't kill us and all that. I have had my arguments with them, and we have agreed to not argue anymore. That said, I am probably not fully free from the egregore because I constantly fight its influence upon me.
 

Xenophon

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Sometimes they can. Power, magical power, originates from the heart and mind operating in unison and articulated in words. Because individuals are, precisely that, individuals , establishing a unity between heart and mind such that the human will is being expressed in word, naturally, will vary to a degree. For some more than others.

The differing sects which you described may, maybe, be cultivating from two different streams which fed from the same spring. And, tbh, they could be completely different streams from different sources. That doesn't matter at all, right?

However, the way to tell if their e teachings are sound, is no different than any teaching, any practice, from any culture, at any time in history. Does it make sense? Does it work consistently? Does it compromise the intellect? Or does it expand it? Is it a crutch? A shortcut, tempting, yet error prone? Etc ...

People online seem to be too sensitive about guarding their precious ego which was developed via some DIY, self-directed,online, kabalah-for-dummies course. Not to mention the rank liberal political bias wafting from the moderator's passive aggressive attempted rebuke.
One difficulty with the test of experience is that its results can be slow in coming. People start to think decay, for instance, is natural."Oh, it's never been safe to go outside after dark!" This said to grandma who remembers very well her middle-age when it was safe. Add to this time one invests in the world-view he is raised in. After 35 years giving generously to Big 'n Benevolent Worldwide Charity, it's hard to accept evidence they've been scamming you for decades.

Mostly experience teaches us the fact that menschus mediocritus is a damned slow learner.
 

Xenophon

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I am not neutral. The only conflicts that matter in my life are those I have with my own flesh and blood precisely because they adhere to beliefs which I have rejected. I would gladly leave them to their religion, yet part of their indoctrination involves conversion. Furthermore, they are taught to shun those who leave their religion. Imagine the certainty they must have in their beliefs, or at the very minimum the sunk cost psychology involved which could motivate some family members to reject association with others. For example, the JWs openly ridicule other Christians who baptize infants, yet they strongly encourage children, even preteens, to get baptized into the faith. Then the child becomes an adult, and what if for some reason he now realizes that the faith of his parents makes no sense? He could decide to remain, unhappily going through the motions. Or he could be honest with his parents and risk being shunned by them.

I'm not sure if a god is actually behind the egregore of the JWs, seeing as how they put Jesus in second place and really, really spend a lot of time harping on the Old Testament stories. It sure has made navigating my life more...interesting. Despite their programming, I am still close to my family. That which doesn't kill us and all that. I have had my arguments with them, and we have agreed to not argue anymore. That said, I am probably not fully free from the egregore because I constantly fight its influence upon me.
I did not say you were. I said that if Harry Dick Thompson cleaves to a creed, I see nothing wrong with him hinting that he thinks it superior. If his style is "subtle insinuation," well then it's up to us to be shrewd enough to take him with a grain of salt.
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Lol. I have it at home, I'm traveling. If you dislike what I wrote, please disregard. I'll not interrupt you further on this. Apologies.
In a word, you are not, "keeping up with the Zhuangzis."
 

Ziran

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Perhaps your over-reaction to what I wrote is influenced by them and the indoc which is still and forever will be engraved on you.

I wish you peace and blessings, but that doesn't mean I will stand by idly while a member of th forum is being given advice which I consider harmful and/or counter productive to their stated aspirations. If it's harsh, too bad. Like Xeno said. At least I'm open, honest, willing to share. At least I care. Even if that's inviting criticism and I'm making myself into a lightening rod, I'd rather do what's right, good, and helpful, to the very best of my capabilities.
 

Jackson

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Perhaps your over-reaction to what I wrote is influenced by them and the indoc which is still and forever will be engraved on you.
Bruh, people do not live their day to day lives "forever engraved"
 

Ziran

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In a word, you are not, "keeping up with the Zhuangzis."

I def don't have it memorized. The sections on cultivation are scattered throughout the book.
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Bruh, people do not live their day to day lives "forever engraved"

That depends. Some do. Trauma is a viscous beast who cuts deep
 

Xenophon

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I def don't have it memorized. The sections on cultivation are scattered throughout the book.
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That depends. Some do. Trauma is a viscous beast who cuts deep
Intellectual debate hath this advantage over chess: when I am at a loss, I can just sneer, "It's is so pointless talking to you till you've read (insert book title here)!" Kind of like Lucky Jack Aubrey sailing his battered sloop into a fog bank before the Frenchies can deliver that last broadside.
 
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